Freethought & Rationalism Archive

IBelieveInHymn · 09-25-2009, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dogfish

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

God's little jar of evil. :Cheeky:

I can't believe atheists believe God destroyed evil and wicked people, but they also believe he created evil. :huh:

That IS strange. You seem to have no problem believing other baseless, false assertions.

Hint: atheist/believe God = oxymoron

I'm starting to see a pattern among many atheists.. I didn't say these atheists believe in God.. I said.. they believe God destroyed evil.. meaning.. the storyline.
:Cheeky:

Dark Virtue · 09-25-2009, 10:21 AM

IBIH,

Once again, you're avoiding the tough questions, so let me ask you yet again...

If Lucifer was created PERFECTLY, as a PERFECT being, by a PERFECT God, how is it possible that evil grew within him?

The text never explains HOW this happened, so it's quite possible that God put it there, especially since you have verses that say God creates evil and that he has a history of doing things like hardening pharoah's heart to further an agenda.

Feel like addressing this?

Dark Virtue · 09-25-2009, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by dog-on

God kept it in a little jar by his bed.

God's little jar of evil. :Cheeky:

I can't believe atheists believe God destroyed evil and wicked people, but they also believe he created evil. :huh:

It's hard to think otherwise when the bible flat out says GOD CREATED EVIL.

Tomk · 09-25-2009, 10:25 AM

It is very obvious that a super dense super hot ball of evil spontaneously formed in Lucifer and it suddenly started expanding into the universe... Um, I mean society that we have today.

Evil wasn't intelligently designed I guess.

WVIncagold · 09-25-2009, 11:29 AM

Remind me how many people has Lucifer actually killed?
How many for YHWH?
Seams to me all lucifer would have to do to beat god is not be an asshole and make hell a more pleasent place than heaven. You know allow all those 613 things YHWH doesnt allow you to do.
Wait IBIH said to look behind me.
Guess what! no imaginary figure was there. Pretty much the very same thing you find whenever the relgious talk about their favorite fairy in the sky who cares more about how they use their genitiles than starving children. Nothing is ever there, no magic sky flying zombie, no comapssion, no real love, only condmenation and bigotry.
Ever hear the greatest trick the devil ever did was making people think he doesnt exist? I think it is more like the greatest trick the devil ever did was to make people follow manmade holy books as gospels and pretend he is a omnipotent omnisceince loving being who kills rapes and performs a butload of attrocities and calls them righteous.

Amaleq13 · 09-25-2009, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

This verse is explaining the wrath of YHWH upon the wicked. That's all. No matter how many times you say otherwise, I see it one way, you see it another.

Yes, you've made it very clear that your beliefs are not dependent upon what the text actually states. You see it as you wish it was written while I take the words as they stand.

Quote:

It's been explained so clearly, I cannot believe people still have a hard time understanding it.

That's because you don't understand the difference between explaining what the text actually states and explaining what your faith tells you the text means.

You are wasting your time in a forum devoted to rational discussion. :wave:

badger3k · 09-25-2009, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deus Ex

Are you saying that Satan is running on a script that can't be changed?

Satan cannot change God's plan. We are witnessing prophecies unfolding.. this is a part of God's plan on the world. Prophecies are like a guidebook leading up to the end of time.

God's plan for the world is predestined. That is proven through fulfilled prophecy. No matter if Satan can change his plans or not, God will interfere and he will be victorious. God unleashed Satan unto the earth. That's why we are witnessing the fall of mankind. (for the second time). Many people are claiming they are non-religious or atheist, that's because Satan wants you to feel that way. It's Satan who is making atheists believe there can't be a God in the Heavens. If you research this subject.. you can clearly see atheism is on the rise in the final hours of the earth. And the bible said this would happen. In the last hours of the earth, scoffers and skeptics will increase, and they will proudly say, where is your Messiah? Some atheists don't even realize this.

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Again the question is: Why would God's number one angel rebel against an omniscient and omnipotent God? I am a measly human being, and I know that I would not be able to win in a rebellion against such an omnimax being. The whole story is silly.

Ezekiel 28:15 says Lucifer was created perfect in all his ways but, evil was found within him, and the evil was not placed there by God.

Lucifer wanted to dominate Heaven because he no longer wanted to take orders from God, because He felt he was a god as well.

Satan believes he is going to de-throne God in the final battle of the world. But he is sadly mistaken.

You don't even see the problem you just said. You said, Satan knows God's plan, knows he can't change it, therefore he knows that he will lose, yet he still believes he is going to dethrone your god. How is that possible? :constern01:

Dark Virtue · 09-25-2009, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badger3k

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Satan cannot change God's plan. We are witnessing prophecies unfolding.. this is a part of God's plan on the world. Prophecies are like a guidebook leading up to the end of time.

God's plan for the world is predestined. That is proven through fulfilled prophecy. No matter if Satan can change his plans or not, God will interfere and he will be victorious. God unleashed Satan unto the earth. That's why we are witnessing the fall of mankind. (for the second time). Many people are claiming they are non-religious or atheist, that's because Satan wants you to feel that way. It's Satan who is making atheists believe there can't be a God in the Heavens. If you research this subject.. you can clearly see atheism is on the rise in the final hours of the earth. And the bible said this would happen. In the last hours of the earth, scoffers and skeptics will increase, and they will proudly say, where is your Messiah? Some atheists don't even realize this.

Ezekiel 28:15 says Lucifer was created perfect in all his ways but, evil was found within him, and the evil was not placed there by God.

Lucifer wanted to dominate Heaven because he no longer wanted to take orders from God, because He felt he was a god as well.

Satan believes he is going to de-throne God in the final battle of the world. But he is sadly mistaken.

You don't even see the problem you just said. You said, Satan knows God's plan, knows he can't change it, therefore he knows that he will lose, yet he still believes he is going to dethrone your god. How is that possible? :constern01:

This would make sense if IBIH would be willing to admit that Satan/Lucifer has/had no free will.

But then that would open up a big ole can of worms.

sdelsolray · 09-25-2009, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by gdeering

Dear IBelieveInHymn,

It seems kind of wrong headed to tip God’s hand, now Satan knows exactly what is going to happen. He’s not called THE Adversary for nothing.

Satan knows what is going to happen without my help. He knows the hour is near. That's why we are witnessing the collapse of mankind. People are worshipping the ways of evil more than the ways of God. II Peter says In the end of days, mankind will become lovers of greed and money before they are lovers of God.

Satan knows God's plan. There is no way to stop it. Hypothetical statement, Satan is very much like Osama bin Laden, he wants to kill as many people as possible before he is caught, and then he is killed himself. Satan knows the hour is drawing near. That's why we are seeing an increase of violence and chaos in the world today.

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If he can read or watch TV then there is a good chance that he knows how it will turn out (as we do) and that it will end badly for him (and many of us) - why wouldn’t he change his plans? These prophecies are just making God’s job harder – that is if he isn’t all knowing and already knows what Satan’s new plans will be???

Satan can't make any "new plans". God's plan was set in motion at the beginning of creation. Satan knows the final outcome, but he can't change it. All he can do is drag down as many innocent people as possible before God unleashes his vengeance on Satan and his band of followers.

You actually believe in these sky fairies of yours, don't you?

My condolences.

sdelsolray · 09-25-2009, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deus Ex

IBIH,

Is there anything that would convince you that you are wrong in your beliefs? Are you infallible?

No one, no atheist, no Hindu, no Buddhist, no Muslim will ever convince me that I'm wrong. I believe God is perfect and just.

And you will never convince anyone that you are "right".

Living with delusions and fantasies is so 14th Century.

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09-25-2009, 10:21 AM	#62
Dark Virtue Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 759	IBIH, Once again, you're avoiding the tough questions, so let me ask you yet again... If Lucifer was created PERFECTLY, as a PERFECT being, by a PERFECT God, how is it possible that evil grew within him? The text never explains HOW this happened, so it's quite possible that God put it there, especially since you have verses that say God creates evil and that he has a history of doing things like hardening pharoah's heart to further an agenda. Feel like addressing this?

09-25-2009, 10:25 AM	#64
Tomk Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Baltimore Posts: 56	It is very obvious that a super dense super hot ball of evil spontaneously formed in Lucifer and it suddenly started expanding into the universe... Um, I mean society that we have today. Evil wasn't intelligently designed I guess.

09-25-2009, 11:29 AM	#65
WVIncagold Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: West Virginina Posts: 4,349	Remind me how many people has Lucifer actually killed? How many for YHWH? Seams to me all lucifer would have to do to beat god is not be an asshole and make hell a more pleasent place than heaven. You know allow all those 613 things YHWH doesnt allow you to do. Wait IBIH said to look behind me. Guess what! no imaginary figure was there. Pretty much the very same thing you find whenever the relgious talk about their favorite fairy in the sky who cares more about how they use their genitiles than starving children. Nothing is ever there, no magic sky flying zombie, no comapssion, no real love, only condmenation and bigotry. Ever hear the greatest trick the devil ever did was making people think he doesnt exist? I think it is more like the greatest trick the devil ever did was to make people follow manmade holy books as gospels and pretend he is a omnipotent omnisceince loving being who kills rapes and performs a butload of attrocities and calls them righteous.

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