Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Huguenot · 01-29-2008, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by makerowner

The city is still there, as you can see in the satellite pictures on Google Earth. It's populated by the descendants of the Phoenicians.

False.

They are Arabs!

deadman_932 · 01-29-2008, 08:47 PM

26:19 For thus says the Lord Yahweh: When I shall make you a desolate city, like the cities that are not inhabited; when I shall bring up the deep on you, and the great waters shall cover you;

Yet Tyre is not under the sea, nor is it a bare rock forever. Nor were the Phoenicians destroyed.

Quote:

Ezekiel clearly predicted that Tyre would be destroyed, become "a bare rock and a place for spreading nets,' and would be built no more forever. By the way, the Phoenicians were not wiped out in 587 BC when Nebuchadrezzar attempts a siege, either. They continued to exist until Alexander comes around 250 years later. And the Phoenicians are still not wiped out, nor is Tyre sunk beneath the sea , etc. etc. Phoenicians at Tyre become self-ruling in 126 BC, for instance. The Phoenicians become the Carthaginians that don't fall to Rome until the end of the Punic Wars at 146 BC., and even then they don't vanish...so HOW the hell did Ezekiel apply to JUST the Phoenician peoples?

So what part of this did you miss, Huguenot? Should I use smaller words in case you only speak Flemish fluently? http://iidb.infidels.org/vbb/showthr...10#post5120910

By the way, "huguenot" -- if you're "Richbee," you may want to prepare for another ban for sock-puppetry.

SkepticalThinker · 01-29-2008, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huguenot

Quote:

Originally Posted by makerowner

The city is still there, as you can see in the satellite pictures on Google Earth. It's populated by the descendants of the Phoenicians.

False.

They are Arabs!

"We're not seeing a significant genetic influence from elsewhere on the coastal population in what was the Levant region," says Wells. "The people are very similar to the groups we see inland in Syria and Jordan, for example, suggesting that there wasn't a huge influx of Sea Peoples or others from outside the area. A cultural shift occurred but not a genetic one. Today's Lebanese, the Phoenicians, and the Canaanites before them are all the same people."

-From http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/ng...ine_extra.html

arnoldo · 01-29-2008, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkepticalThinker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huguenot

False.

They are Arabs!

"We're not seeing a significant genetic influence from elsewhere on the coastal population in what was the Levant region," says Wells. "The people are very similar to the groups we see inland in Syria and Jordan, for example, suggesting that there wasn't a huge influx of Sea Peoples or others from outside the area. A cultural shift occurred but not a genetic one. Today's Lebanese, the Phoenicians, and the Canaanites before them are all the same people."

-From http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/ng...ine_extra.html

The argument that because Tyre exist today the ancient powerful city/state continues to exist is absurd. It's like saying the Confederacy of the United States continues to exist because it's capital Richmond, Virginia continues to exist. In any event the original Tyre was thrown into the ocean by Alexander the Great. That city was never rebuilt.

deadman_932 · 01-29-2008, 09:11 PM

Is Tyre under the sea? Tyre was rebuilt and continued to be mentioned in Roman works. Lots of cities were burnt to the ground in the past and rebuilt. This is no different except you want to force history to back a failed prophecy. That's just kinda tragic there, Arnie.

Darklighter · 01-29-2008, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Wrong. See post #498. Your merely speaking half truths. IIRC that's a common tactic of someone. . . .

Ummm.... that post is just a re-statement of what you and sugar have been saying the whole time. Despite the fact that neither history nor the WORDS OF EZEKIEL, support that fantasy. And despite the fact that that cop-out has been disproven over and over and over and over... Yeah post #498 has NO TRUTH in it.

There's about a couple hundred posts in this thread (by myself and others) that put a boot in the ass of post #498. Ouch.

You still as yet havn't dealt with the fact that Tyre was rebuilt several times. It doesn't matter if the "ancient ruins are underneath blahblahblah", ther are buildings on the site. The site is called Tyre. Meaning Tyre was rebuilt. Tyre is inhabited.

Darklighter · 01-29-2008, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huguenot

Quote:

Originally Posted by makerowner

The city is still there, as you can see in the satellite pictures on Google Earth. It's populated by the descendants of the Phoenicians.

False.

They are Arabs!

Now that SkepticalThinker has proven that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about, maybe you can stop making such an ass of your self.

Haha, only in the xenophobic mind of a fundamentalist could 'muslim' and 'Arab' be interchangeable. Hey genius, did you know that the Iranians arn't arabs either?

Sheshonq · 01-29-2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Quote:

In 332 B.C. Alexander the Great set out to conquer this strategic coastal base in the war between the Greeks and the Persians.Unable to storm the city, he blockaded Tyre for seven months. Again Tyre held on. But the conqueror used the debris of the abandoned mainland city to build a causeway and once within reach of the city walls, Alexander used his siege engines to batter and finally breach the fortifications. It is said that The public baths Alexander was so enraged at the Tyrians' defense and the loss of his men that he destroyed half the city. The town's 30,000 residents were massacred or sold into slavery. Tyre and the whole of ancient Syria fell under Roman rule in 64 B.C.. Nonetheless, for some time Tyre continued to mint its own silver coins.
The Romans built great important monuments in the city, including an aqueduct,
a triumphal arch and the largest hippodrome in antiquity.
http://www.middleeast.com/tyre.htm

Question: How did Alexander the Great reach Tyre?
Answer: He threw the city into the sea.

Wrong. He reached it with ships.

Then when that didn't work, he took rubble from the mainland colony and built a mole.

But that also failed to work.*

* It's not a trick question for anyone who knows the history. arnoldo doesn't, however. :Cheeky:

Sheshonq · 01-29-2008, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshonq

Another question showing the holes in your education. You have the sequence of cause-effect backwards.

The fact that they were strong enough to survive a 13-year siege is precisely WHY they were able force Nebuchadnezzar to a draw.

In addition a 13 year siege is what allowed the wealth of the city to be transfered to the island. Thus Nebby had nothing for his siege as Ezekiel writes.

Horseshit. The wealth was already on the island, because it was by far the wealthier of the two.

Sheshonq · 01-29-2008, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnoldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshonq

Let me just add one more source. Although I hate Wikipedia - it's useful to show how easily arnoldo could have checked his claims -- had he cared about accuracy in any way, shape or form:

I guess that's why it took Alexander the Great SEVEN months to walk across a natural land bridge to destroy Tyre?

1. How long do you think it took to *build* in the first place?

2. The mole didn't work, so the timeline doesn't matter.

3. And of course, none of this changes the fact that YOU DISHONESTLY TWISTED THE BRITANNICA ENTRY AND REWROTE A COPYRIGHTED SOURCE

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01-29-2008, 09:11 PM	#535
deadman_932 Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Altadena, California Posts: 3,271	Is Tyre under the sea? Tyre was rebuilt and continued to be mentioned in Roman works. Lots of cities were burnt to the ground in the past and rebuilt. This is no different except you want to force history to back a failed prophecy. That's just kinda tragic there, Arnie.

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