Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Malachi151 · 05-08-2007, 05:03 AM

I have seen several confusing things about so-called Nazareth in the Gospels. One issue seems to be that "Nazareth" wasn't actually mentioned in the Gospel of Mark, some other place was. Is this correct?

jgibson000 · 05-08-2007, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

I have seen several confusing things about so-called Nazareth in the Gospels. One issue seems to be that "Nazareth" wasn't actually mentioned in the Gospel of Mark, some other place was. Is this correct?

Could you tell us, please, what exactly it is that you have "seen" and, more importantly, where it is that you have seen these "confusing things"?

Jeffrey Gibson

Ben C Smith · 05-08-2007, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

I have seen several confusing things about so-called Nazareth in the Gospels. One issue seems to be that "Nazareth" wasn't actually mentioned in the Gospel of Mark, some other place was. Is this correct?

Not in the text as it stands. Nazareth appears at Mark 1.9, clear as a bell.

There was a lengthy thread dedicated to the issue of Nazareth in the synoptics not too long ago.

Ben.

Malachi151 · 05-08-2007, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben C Smith

Not in the text as it stands. Nazareth appears at Mark 1.9, clear as a bell.

There was a lengthy thread dedicated to the issue of Nazareth in the synoptics not too long ago.

Ben.

Thanks Ben.

I am particularly interested in Mark. Below are each of the instances of Nazareth in the NRSV translation of Mark:

Quote:

Mark 1.9:
In those days Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan.

Quote:

Mark 1.24:
and he cried out, ‘What have you to do with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are, the Holy One of God.’

Quote:

Mark 10.47:
When he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to shout out and say, ‘Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!’

Quote:

Mark 14.67:
When she saw Peter warming himself, she stared at him and said, ‘You also were with Jesus, the man from Nazareth.’

Quote:

Mark 16.6:
But he said to them, ‘Do not be alarmed; you are looking for Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He has been raised; he is not here. Look, there is the place they laid him.

We also have this mention of his "home town":

Quote:

Mark 2:1:
When he returned to Capernaum after some days, it was reported that he was at home.

Since I don't know Greek, can someone explain exactly what these passages say in the earliest manuscripts, and if they don't say Nazareth, why do they say Nazareth now?

This post may be of use to those who know Greek:

http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...83#post4012883

Thanks

spin · 05-08-2007, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

Thanks Ben.

I am particularly interested in Mark. Below are each of the instances of Nazareth in the NRSV translation of Mark:

We also have this mention of his "home town":

Since I don't know Greek, can someone explain exactly what these passages say in the earliest manuscripts, and if they don't say Nazareth, why do they say Nazareth now?

This post may be of use to those who know Greek:

http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...83#post4012883

I've gone over this material with a fine-toothed comb here. Only the very first says Nazareth. All the others say nazarhnos (h=eta). This is an apparent gentilic not directly derivable from Nazareth. (I argue elsewhere that the term comes from a Hebrew word NZR meaning "crown, dedicated" and related to Nazirite.) It is merely an assumption that Nazarene means from Nazareth.

spin

Malachi151 · 05-08-2007, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin

I've gone over this material with a fine-toothed comb here. Only the very first says Nazareth. All the others say nazarhnos (h=eta). This is an apparent gentilic not directly derivable from Nazareth. (I argue elsewhere that the term comes from a Hebrew word NZR meaning "crown, dedicated" and related to Nazirite.) It is merely an assumption that Nazarene means from Nazareth.

spin

Why, then, does the first instance say Nazareth? In the first instance a later interpolation?

Ben C Smith · 05-08-2007, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

Why, then, does the first instance say Nazareth? In the first instance a later interpolation?

That is what spin argues, yes.

Ben.

Malachi151 · 05-08-2007, 05:06 PM

So, based on this: http://www.hypotyposeis.org/weblog/2...-nazareth.html

These should read:

Quote:

Mark 1.9:
In those days Jesus came from Nazaret of Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan.

Quote:

Mark 1.24:
and he cried out, ‘What have you to do with us, Jesus the Nazarene? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are, the Holy One of God.’

Quote:

Mark 10.47:
When he heard that it was Jesus the Nazarene, he began to shout out and say, ‘Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!’

Quote:

Mark 14.67:
When she saw Peter warming himself, she stared at him and said, ‘You also were with the Nazarene, Jesus.’

Quote:

Mark 16.6:
But he said to them, ‘Do not be alarmed; you are looking for Jesus the Nazarene, who was crucified. He has been raised; he is not here. Look, there is the place they laid him.

spin · 05-08-2007, 05:11 PM

Yup.

Ben C Smith · 05-09-2007, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

So, based on this: http://www.hypotyposeis.org/weblog/2...-nazareth.html

These should read....

What you have to understand about the Nazareth reference in Mark 1.9 is that removing it tugs on a thread that quickly starts to unravel. In the course of arguing for Nazareth as an interpolation in 1.9, spin uncovered a host of interpolations across our synoptic gospels, including a phrase in the Lucan homecoming story and several details in the Matthean denial story.

Ben.

05-08-2007, 05:03 AM	#1
Malachi151 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Colorado Posts: 8,674	"Nazareth" in the Gospel of Mark? I have seen several confusing things about so-called Nazareth in the Gospels. One issue seems to be that "Nazareth" wasn't actually mentioned in the Gospel of Mark, some other place was. Is this correct?

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05-08-2007, 05:11 PM	#9
spin Contributor Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: nowhere Posts: 15,747	Yup.

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