simon kole

That is outside my purview, which is examining the actual textual content of the whole Bible for any actual textual contradictions therein. And this concerns you, why?

It is not relevant to examining the content of Biblical texts for actual textual contradictions, which is my purview.

Davka

HOLD everything!

God's covenant with the Jews was an "everlasting" covenant, according to YHWH.

A covenant which can become obsolete is NOT "everlasting."

So if the NT claims that the "everlasting" covenant is obsolete, along with the Law which was to be FOREVER, then the NT is contradicting the OT.

If the covenant was not everlasting, why does the OT say it was?

If the covenant was everlasting, why does the NT claim it is not?

Mega Fail.

simon kole

You know as well as I do that the former refers to the divided kingdom, and Paul is referring to all the Jews.

That root being the believing patriarchs.
That is precisely the work of the Holy Spirit in the NT.That will be accomplished in the eternal Messianic kingdom of the new heavens and the new earth.

Methinks it is thou who dost not understand Paul's real position regarding the Law.

Paul said all those who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for not keeping it perfectly (Gal 3:10).
That hardness of their hearts is hatred and rejection of Jesus of Nazareth as their Messiah.The Law remains active and in full force for no one as a way of obtaining the promises and the Kingdom.

It is replaced by faith in Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah as the only way to obtain the promises and the Kingdom. Israel will at last publicly cry out regarding Jesus of Nazareth. . .Then, and only then, when Israel (the Hebrews) shouts joyfully to the world the acceptance of Jesus of Nazareth as her Messiah, will they at long last reap the promise of forgiveness and of the Kingdom.

which also includes disobedience to Father God's command, given through Jesus
(who spoke only what Father God told him to say**),
to "Repent and believe in the Lord Jesus Christ (Mk 1:15; Ac 16:30-31)._____________________

** Jn 12:50, 7:16, 8:25-28, 12:44-45, 49-50; 14:10; Lk 9:35, 10:16

simon kole

It's up to you whether or not to accept what the letter to the Hebrews reports.

simon kole

Firin' from the hip?

And why does God say he will make a new covenant (Jer 31:31)?

Sheshbazzar

A 'thousand generations' of Israel. How many years are in a generation of Israel?

40 years? 40x1000= 40,000 years.

20 years? 20x1000= 20,000 years.

A 'thousand generations' is a long, long, long time, certainly much longer than a paltry 3000 years or so.

simon, The New Covenant is real, but it only becomes effective if one dies.

This is the reason for our 'baptism', being laid down into that watery grave, the old man dies, and is put to rest, and a new man comes to life and arises from that 'grave'.
This new man is no longer under the curses of the Law, because his baptism is accounted as the death of the flesh, that he might henceforth live forevermore in the spirit.
Once accomplished, that soul thenceforth being accounted as now among those who have died, cannot sin. For Yahweh will no longer impute any sin to those washed and justified by the water, and by the blood. (Psa 32:1-2, Rom 4:7-8)
All things therefore become lawful unto them who are so blessed, but not all things become expedient.

Yet for them that -live in the flesh- The LAW of Yahweh FOREVER remains unto their condemnation.
For without The Law sin is not made manifest, and "sin is the transgressions of The Law;" Wherefore The Law remains that transgressions and sin might abound in the children of disobedience.

But unto Israel Yahweh has spoken; "Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in Yahweh your Elohim: for He hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month."

"Ask ye of Yahweh rain in the time of the latter rain; Yahweh shall make bright clouds, and give them showers of rain, to every one grass in the field."

"Then shall we know, if we follow on to know Yahweh: His going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth."

"I will give you the rain of your land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain,"

"Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Master.
Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain."

A small harvest, even a 'wave sheaf', then a long growing season unto the time of the latter rain, after that comes the final great harvest.

Then there shall be great rejoicing in The Feast of Ingathering over the abundance of The Great Harvest. "And so shall all Israel be saved."
hallelu-YAH!


edited to add.
But I see by your above response that your heart is hard set against the receiving of any such good words.

You say; "You know as well as I do that the former refers to the divided kingdom, and Paul is referring to all the Jews."
With what words does Paul refer to all Jews in Hebrews 8:8 ?

You say; "the believing patriarchs." But that clearly is not of whom Paul is speaking in Romans 11:11-32.
Let any one read those words and see your error.

If you must be this dishonest in your reading of the texts, there is nothing more I can offer, other than a prayer for you, for this shame which you bring upon yourself..




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Davka

BibleGod made lots of covenants. Each one was new. But the making of a new covenant in no way nullified those covenants which went before.

Once again, mega fail. You CANNOT show that YHWH of the OT ever intended his everlasting covenants to be anything other than everlasting.

Steve Weiss

But what if a Jew becomes an atheist or a Christian, Buddhist or Hindu? Would the covenant be broken? Can't Jews get out of it by breaking all the rules? What if a Jew just ignores the whole thing?

Sheshbazzar

Poor simon cannot get it through his head that minus The Laws of YHWH, sin is not made manifest, and "sin is the transgressions of The Law;" (1 John 3:4)
Wherefore The Law must needs remain that transgressions and sin might abound -and be made manifest- in the children of disobedience.
Without The Law of YHWH to define what is sin, one may not know what it is that constitutes sin in the eyes of YHWH.
As Paul said; "I had not known sin, except by The Law." (Rom 7:7)
And sin has not ceased because The Law has not ceased. For this cause Israel is yet under guilt unto this day, in that they cannot do (even if willing) ALL that which The Law requires of them. Yet Israel (the Jews) for the sake of His promises, are predicted to be, by His Mercy, wholly redeemed from that guilt in due time. (Jer 31:33-34)
This will not be their doing, but will be His doing, when in due season He sends 'the latter rain' abundantly upon the grass of His people Israel. He will pour out His spirit upon them, when He is ready to do so, until then, they cannot be other than as they are, as He has made them to be, for the sake of the saving of the Gentiles.





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Perspicuo

That His Law is everlasting? It's the NT writers who don't think so. It's not up to me, it's the logical inconsistency of the Bible. Coincidentally, the subject of this thread.

Interesting read on the subject:
WHY DON'T JEWS BELIEVE IN JESUS? (Jewish site)

• Jesus did not fulfill the messianic prophecies in scripture.
• Jesus did not embody the scriptural qualifications of the Messiah.
• Biblical verses referring to Jesus are mistranslations.
• Christianity contradicts Jewish scripture.