manimal2878

Matthew 11:18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.
11:19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners.

Any thoughts I think it would be awesome if Jesus were a gluttenous drunk, I'm sure the fundies somehow "twist" the meaning of this to mean Jesus is not a swell fun loving guy.

andrewcriddle

Jesus was apparently accused by his opponents of being a drunkard.

This should be regarded as a hostile interpretation not an objective comment. However, it would not have been plausible, as a sneer or criticism, if Jesus was in reality teetotal.

Andrew Criddle

rich442

The entire religion of Christianity is based on the fact that Jesus was a normal man [as well as a god--that's the theory]. Normal men eat food and wash it down with fluids [since we are 90% water]. Al jiuce in the early years of Jesus' time were composed of wine because there were no refrigerators. Juice fermented in days and most people drank--wine. Winebbier souns mean and unrealistic, though.

Your theory is very enjoyable, though. :thumbs:

sharon45

Jesus many times taught like he was drunk, but it is not shown that he actually was one.

This part's main purpose was to show that people have different methods of communicating their messages. John kept away from others in the wilds, so potential followers had to be willing to come to him. Now jesus traveled and tried to mingle in with a diverse section of the whole, doing somewhat as they did. While some observers may find these techniques questionable or criticize them, what is most important are the results.

vsop44

In fact luke calls a spade a spade .
Luke 7 :34: The Son of man has come eating and drinking; and you say, `Behold, a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!'


And the penalty for a drunkard and a glutton under the jewish law was ? Deuteronomy 21 :20-21 makes it very clear , you be the judge .

deuteronomy 21
20: and they shall say to the elders of his city, `This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.'

21: Then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones; so you shall purge the evil from your midst; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.

See , you can make the bible say anything you want ! :devil1:

manimal2878

damn.

gee

manimal2878;

"you can make the bible say anything you want ! "

If you twist everything out of context you can. It doesn't make it logical, or consistent.


Consider some important points of this passage starting at Matthew 11:

- John the Baptist is sitting in jail and wondering why.
- He sends some of his followers to ask Jesus if he's the Messiah.
- Jesus answers by telling them to report what they have seen (miracles and such)
- Then he speaks of the generation he's dealing with.
- They pine for their Messiah and whine about their condition (played the flute..etc.)
- but when the Messiah comes (and John the Baptist) they find excuses to disregard their teachings.
- the most interesting part is with John the Baptist. He didn't even believe Jesus because he was sitting in jail. He ended up dead. I don't think he expected the Messiah to come in this fashion.

Just my opinion anyway.
I don't think you believe this stuff, but ask a Biblical question and you're gonna' get a biblical answer.

gee

vsop44

What do you think the fundies , creationists et al are doing quoting bible passages ad nauseatum .

I have never read the bible in its entirety , but I'm glad , in a way, that I did study it for a while and if I had to read it , this is the version that I would use .

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/

manimal2878

Well I believe that there might be some truth to the history of what is done in the bible but that it has been recorded by ignorant myth believing peoples who didn't have the reason and reliable science that we have today, they recorded things in the only way they knew how.

I would really like to believe there was a normal guy named Jesus who was inspired to challenge the current status and injustice of the current religious thinking. The only was I can belive in Jesus though, is as a historical figure without all the dogma and bullshit that seems to have been added by those wanting the power of religion and not the truth of what Jesus taught. Refer to, "The Jefferson Bible" to see what I mean. I am reminded of the scene in braveheart, where he has to tell the soldiers that he is William Wallace because they were expecting the myth of Wallace which was this 10 ft tall fire breathing type of dude.

I see the bible as being illogical and taken out of the context of the reality of what we know now. The very fact that people try so hard to prove ID makes me sick and angry. I think people forget that the church use to be very pro science, seeing it as a way to study Gods works, I believe the first Bioligists were monks and the "cell" is named such because it reminded them of their little dorms rooms, the cells.

Where did this retarded idea that the scripture is inerrant come from anyway, Jesus didn't believe it, he denounced the scripture of his day, Luther didn't believe the inerrant reading of the catholic scripture, fuck, he didn't even translate James or Revelations into German because he didn't think they were authentic. SO why is it that these "Bible Believers" think they know more than Jesus and know more than Luther, the only reason they're not praying to Mary right now?

I guess you will quote some biblical crap about the rightness of the word or something, maybe something from Revalations like 22:7 or from Timothy, but guess what anything written in there is no more believable than quoting my post if I were to add at the end of it: "I am right and you are wrong" to prove my point.

And even if the word were true, there are like 5000 christian denominations in the United States alone all of them claiming their truth based sola scriptura. Which interpretation is right? I know, refer to the bible. See how silly it is. I now have the 5001st "truth" from what I have read.

gee

manimal2878;

"See how silly it is..."

Well, you asked.
This is just my opinion.
I never said it was the "end all" of the interpretation.

Do you think the entire Bible is silly, or is there anything in it that makes sense to you?

gee