Freethought & Rationalism Archive

ex-preacher · 12-20-2003, 10:29 AM

As I read Deut. 22:23-24, both the Virgin Mary and the Holy Spirit should have been brought to the town gate and stoned to death. Mary was pledged to marry another, yet was made pregnant by God. Of course, God was above his own laws, but was Mary?

Toto · 12-20-2003, 12:18 PM

Quote:

22 If a man is found sleeping with another man's wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman must die. You must purge the evil from Israel.

23 If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death-the girl because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man's wife. You must purge the evil from among you.

There are undoubtedly some loopholes here. Maybe this didn't happen in a town. Maybe it was artificial insemination, not sleeping with her.

The punishment for adultery was so severe that legal minds managed to find ways around it. During the Monica Lewinsky national obsession, some Jewish rabbis did give their opinion that oral sex was not adultery - that because the consequences were so drastic, the crime was defined very strictly.

offa · 12-20-2003, 10:41 PM

Adultery is being unfaithful. It is about faith --- not sexual intercourse. The adultery did not occur until Jesus was 12 (actually 24) years old in 17/18 CE when he chose another father (with a father being a chief priest and not a daddy). Joseph (Cleophas) was the holy spirit and Jesus' daddy.

judge · 12-20-2003, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ex-preacher
As I read Deut. 22:23-24, both the Virgin Mary and the Holy Spirit should have been brought to the town gate and stoned to death. Mary was pledged to marry another, yet was made pregnant by God. Of course, God was above his own laws, but was Mary?

Also the law said..."by the evidence of two or three witnesses let every fact be confirmed"

Adora · 12-21-2003, 04:27 PM

Depends. I've heard discussion on this suggesting Mary's family was higher up in the Jewish social scale than others, and so their status prevented her from being prosecuted (wow, just like rich people today). I've also heard others suggesting it was all, of course, just a legend created to exemplify Jesus' birth and conception into something divine, therefore going by the "The Holy Spirit Protected Her" dogma. Others say it was rape, so therefore no one could prove her infidelity. Of course, the last one falls flat in the face of gender issues at the time. I'm mostly a subscriber to the old "It's a legend/myth. Don't think too hard about the specifics" school.

12-21-2003, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Adora
. I'm mostly a subscriber to the old "It's a legend/myth. Don't think too hard about the specifics" school.

But legends and myths are based on truths so that answer really doesn't work around here.

The virgin birth must be contemplated in view of a non-virgin birth and Mary is just the name given to be juxtaposed with the Eve who will do a non-virgin rebirth anytime, anyplace, whenever a "carcass" [read bleading heart] is found.

Adora · 12-21-2003, 09:08 PM

Legends and myths are based on interpretations of events. As your many weird and wonderful posts about your interpretations of these myths goes to show

Ellis14 · 12-22-2003, 12:34 PM

But God never had sexual intercourse with Mary did he? nor had she had sexual relations with a man at the time because she was a virgin.

God impregnated Mary with Jesus, through some magical supernatural powers that we can only speculate on. god did not have sex with Mary. Artificial inpregnation doesn't constitute a loss of virginity does it??

Therefore Mary was above reproach. It was only suggested she might be stoned by those who didn't know or didn't believe that she had indeed been implanted by God.

Doctor X · 12-22-2003, 12:52 PM

If not stoned, at least drunk to believe the "Hey Baby, I'm God!" pick-up line. . . .

--J.D.

12-22-2003, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ellis10
God impregnated Mary with Jesus, through some magical supernatural powers that we can only speculate on. god did not have sex with Mary. Artificial inpregnation doesn't constitute a loss of virginity does it??

By now [sic] God is neuter anyway so how can he have a live sperm? Let me suggest that the Visitation by Gabriel took place in the same mind and at the same time that Joseph had a dream. So that kind of means that there was no physical birth but just the rebirth of Joseph unto whom Christ was born and because of this new dual identity they called him Jesus.

12-20-2003, 10:29 AM	#1
ex-preacher Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: University of Arkansas Posts: 1,033	Under OT Law, Virgin Mary should have been stoned As I read Deut. 22:23-24, both the Virgin Mary and the Holy Spirit should have been brought to the town gate and stoned to death. Mary was pledged to marry another, yet was made pregnant by God. Of course, God was above his own laws, but was Mary?

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12-20-2003, 10:41 PM	#3
offa Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Monroeville, Ohio, USA Posts: 440	Adultery is being unfaithful. It is about faith --- not sexual intercourse. The adultery did not occur until Jesus was 12 (actually 24) years old in 17/18 CE when he chose another father (with a father being a chief priest and not a daddy). Joseph (Cleophas) was the holy spirit and Jesus' daddy.

12-21-2003, 04:27 PM	#5
Adora Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,743	Depends. I've heard discussion on this suggesting Mary's family was higher up in the Jewish social scale than others, and so their status prevented her from being prosecuted (wow, just like rich people today). I've also heard others suggesting it was all, of course, just a legend created to exemplify Jesus' birth and conception into something divine, therefore going by the "The Holy Spirit Protected Her" dogma. Others say it was rape, so therefore no one could prove her infidelity. Of course, the last one falls flat in the face of gender issues at the time. I'm mostly a subscriber to the old "It's a legend/myth. Don't think too hard about the specifics" school.

12-21-2003, 09:08 PM	#7
Adora Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,743	Legends and myths are based on interpretations of events. As your many weird and wonderful posts about your interpretations of these myths goes to show

12-22-2003, 12:34 PM	#8
Ellis14 Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: England Posts: 3,934	But God never had sexual intercourse with Mary did he? nor had she had sexual relations with a man at the time because she was a virgin. God impregnated Mary with Jesus, through some magical supernatural powers that we can only speculate on. god did not have sex with Mary. Artificial inpregnation doesn't constitute a loss of virginity does it?? Therefore Mary was above reproach. It was only suggested she might be stoned by those who didn't know or didn't believe that she had indeed been implanted by God.

12-22-2003, 12:52 PM	#9
Doctor X Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: USA Posts: 3,794	If not stoned, at least drunk to believe the "Hey Baby, I'm God!" pick-up line. . . . --J.D.

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