Kattaz

Hello Theophage,

There are many specifics (I identify at least ten) but I will write them one after the other to give the possibility of talking about this.
One of my „favorite” is 18:11 "The merchants of the earth will weep and mourn over her because no one buys their cargoes any more”. The economic events who fellow the 11 september 2001 are a specific point, because the consumption has drasticaly reduced, and even president Bush appear in face of the nation to ask people to buy products, or else economy risk to collapse. I also remarc the words used by the Revelation: „no one buys their cargoes any more” who are at the present, and that give the posibility that this situation can change in the future. I think that is a profecy itself, and it confirm the Babilon collapse.

Kattaz

The second argument is right the name: World Trade Center
18:15 „The merchants who sold these things and gained their wealth from her will ...”
These things are very well detalied in verses 12 and 13, and these verses show all possible goods on the market, with the eyes of Ioan, Revelation author, a man who live 2000 years ago. The Babilon is described like a center of trade for entire world 18:3 „ ... and the merchants of the earth grew rich from her excessive luxuries”.
As we know WTC is a international organization who have branches in all the world, even here in Romania. All this branches was coordianted from New York, and develop internacional commerce.

orac

Kattaz, let's say for the sake of argument you're 100% right.

Can you please explain why you chose not to tell anyone about your insight before it actually happened?

You're explaining all your reasons why you knew beforehand that the WTC was going to be destroyed which is great, but if you knew this why didn't you tell someone before it happened?

Alternatively, how come you didn't find this amazing prophecy til afterwards? Isn't that a bit inconvienent?

Incidentally, your "specifics" could apply to any international trade organisation, and apparantly God missed the fact that destroying a couple of buildings hasn't actually destroyed international trade. The US economy is a little shakey but there's more than one reason for that, and very large parts of the rest of the world are simply carrying on as normal.

Still, you've got all these "specifics" that show why this prophecy could only have applied to this one specific event, and I'ld love to know why noone actually knew that until after the event. It's almost as if it wasn't very specific but was actually general and vague so it can be applied to many different circumstances.

Kattaz

For your ask: before this event I haven’t internet acces. I only use internet from 6 months, and I am member of this forum from a week. The next event is the first plague of seven ones, possible antrax or something with similar efects.

Kattaz

OK, first of all, I am not a prophet. The prophet is John, who write the Revelation.
The third argument is the time of collapse. Revelation 18:10 „... in one hour is thy judgment come” and Revelation 18:17 „For in one hour so great riches is come to nought ...” speak about a specific time. John 11:9 show us that even Jesus adopted Babylonian time in which a light time day is divided in twelve hours. But what we know about WTC? How much time was passed from the first airplane impact to the final collapse? The time was exactly one hour. This is not only a miraculous coincidence, that is a fact.

Amaleq13

Kattaz,


I look forward to the rest of your "specifics" because the first three are not terribly impressive since they do not appear to be accurate.

I don't know what translation you are using but Young's Literal Translation gives "city":

"from afar having stood because of the fear of her torment, saying, Wo, wo, the great city! Babylon, the strong city!..." (Rev 18:10)

The word "city" is used a total of six times but the word "fortress" never occurs. In fact, I can't find any translation that supports "fortress".

Wo, wo, STRIKE ONE!

An economic "collapse" did not, in fact, occur. The primary economic impact was in the travel industry not international trade. STRIKE TWO!

The first plane struck at 8:45 a.m. EDT. The south tower fell at 10:05 a.m. EDT. The north tower fell at 10:28 a.m. EDT. From the time of the first strike until the fall of the second tower is one hour and forty-three minutes.

STRIKE THREE!

Feel free to consult the chronology provided by CNN:

http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/09/11/chronology.attack/

I bet this kind of sloppy "fulfillment" was more credible before the internet.

I can't wait to see the other seven if these were what you lead with.

Kattaz

1. City or fortress. The Babilon is named „the great city”, but is named also „the great whore” (19:2). It can’t be this two in the same time, so is obviously this names epitomize something, not describe something.
2. Sorry if you don’t remember, but after this events the consumption (and that involve peoples short-time reaction) has drasticaly reduced.
3. 9:03 a.m.: A second hijacked airliner, United Airlines Flight 175 from Boston, crashes into the south tower of the World Trade Center and explodes. Both buildings are burning.
10:05 a.m.: The south tower of the World Trade Center collapses, plummeting into the streets below. A massive cloud of dust and debris forms and slowly drifts away from the building.

Amaleq13

Just because you say "city or fortress" doesn't make it so. Every translation has "city" so your "fortress" is as much a figment of your imagination as reading the WTC disaster into the text.

I remember quite well and your "prophecy" doesn't fit. Revelation 18:11f clearly describes trade ending not simply experiencing a temporary lull. There is no question that the greatest and longest lasting economic impact was upon the travel industry. While trade has recovered significantly, one could argue that the travel industry is still suffering the effects. It is simply unfortunate for your beliefs that there is nothing even remotely resembling a description of the actual facts.

Your selection of the second plane rather than the first as well as your selection of the first tower to fall rather than the last are entirely arbitrary and clearly intended to provide the hour you declared was "exactly" predicted. Even this entirely invalid selective attention to the evidence fails to give you "exactly" an hour as you claimed.

This is utter nonsense without any basis in reality.

mark9950

Why is the sears tower,empire state building and many other tall skyscrapers still standing.

Please do not give allah the credit for murdering many people and destroying many families.

Even though God can break his own law and we aint supposed to.

geekfish-san

::stands, flipping two pennies::

i've got two cents here.

first, i must say that this "fact" was debated already by the heads of the protestant and catholic chuches with a highly respected professor in Cambridge. there was much strawmen and circular reasoning, and that verse, in its entirety, was quoted. i studied for a long time in the realm of Revalation. nice, holy waste of time it was. anyway, i don't intend to be so rash and vulgar. i will make my points.

babylon is a city in which its "king" is worshipped. don't believe me? read the old testament from II Kings to Malachi. it's in there, especially in daniel. Speaking of Daniel, compare the verses in Revelation 18 with that of Daniel 7 and 11. you will see many parallels. which means the city of babylon, called "fallen," is the actual city of babylon, located 100 kilometers north of Ur, in Iraq. it will be a religious place (i highly doubt nyc is very religious... i've been there many a times) and i doubt even more that the world trade centers, representing capitalism in its general form, is in any way shape or form descriptive of new york. it says that Babylon is fallen. not "That unholy tower and it's sister hath fallen, fallen, fallen is that tower in the great city." sorry. it's not like all of new york died. it was no more than 7000 dead. unfortunately, nyc's population is upwards of 3 million. not to be morbid, but that's only .23% of the population. forgive me for being so blunt, i had a member of my life taken by it. but i have gone off track.

further notes, if you have read the rest of revelation, and/or done some studies of the depth that you must go to understand it, you will learn that there is a time line to revelation. if you go through the cross reverencing with daniel chapters 6, 7, 11, and 12, you can figure out that time line. and revelation chapter 18 is supposed to happen at the END, you heard me, END of the 7th year, after the sixth bowl/vial is poured out. it is almost the last sign of christ returning in his entirety to earth. but i haven't seen the first 7 seals, seven trumpets, and five bowls/vials of wrath. out population has not dropped by 75%, which, discounting the rapture, is the amount of people to die from boils, hail, the waters turning to blood, the climate changes, the earthquakes, the "angels given power to smite half the earth," or any of the other 21 curses/plagues of the revelation.

my name is geekfish, i studied the bible for 13 years, and i'm a pagan. i'll be here the rest of my life.