Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Zucco · 03-17-2004, 09:33 AM

Matthew 11:19
19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.

Does this verse imply that Jesus drank too much wine or am I misunderstanding the "Son of Man" reference? I find it hard to believe that god incarnate needed a little nip here and there to get through the day.

funinspace · 03-17-2004, 10:55 AM

It would if you presumed that the people insulting Jesus were being honest and clear. I think a fair understanding of the verse is that the people were being derogatory. You don't even have to be a believer to get to that conclusion. But I would also say that the verse makes it pretty obvious, when considered with the whole NT, that Jesus drank alcohol...Don't tell the Baptists

DK

blt to go · 03-17-2004, 12:16 PM

Quote:

that Jesus drank alcohol...Don't tell the Baptists

Sad but true...when I was a young "baptist" we were informed that the wine of the N.T. was 1/20 the alcohol content of current wine.

Even as a kid, we saw that did not make sense. There are accusations, and clear references to being "drunk." You would have to have the bladder the size of a small sheep to drink that low of a content of alcohol and get drunk.

This would be less alcohol than Nyquil

Magus55 · 03-17-2004, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by funinspace
It would if you presumed that the people insulting Jesus were being honest and clear. I think a fair understanding of the verse is that the people were being derogatory. You don't even have to be a believer to get to that conclusion. But I would also say that the verse makes it pretty obvious, when considered with the whole NT, that Jesus drank alcohol...Don't tell the Baptists

DK

Yes I imagine Jesus did drink alcohol considering wine was served at passover. Drinking isn't a sin, over indulgence is.

funinspace · 03-17-2004, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Drinking isn't a sin, over indulgence is.

Yep, couldn't agree more. Though I will always remember how proud several members of my former local Bible/fundy Church was that they didn't touch that wicked stuff. And how many will twist the obvious to suite their puritanical preferences. And is just amazing (almost entertaining) to watch a preacher dance over a verse that doesn't fit with their "faith statement".

DK

Doctor X · 03-17-2004, 01:49 PM

I remember one trying to argue that "they did not have wine back then, they had grape juice."

Sometimes, you just have to laugh.

--J.D.

Yannis (J'ohn) · 03-17-2004, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor X
I remember one trying to argue that "they did not have wine back then, they had grape juice."

Aha! So, in the marriage of Cana, Jesus turned water into Ribbena!

Who said that apologetics don't make sense?

SBS

Hazel-rah · 03-17-2004, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Yes I imagine Jesus did drink alcohol considering wine was served at passover. Drinking isn't a sin, over indulgence is.

1. It was just Manischiewicz. Awful stuff.
2. "If there ain't COLD BEER in heaven..."

DaMan121 · 03-17-2004, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Aha! So, in the marriage of Cana, Jesus turned water into Ribbena!

LOL! Ribbena rocks!

Doctor X · 03-17-2004, 10:46 PM

Indeed, later apologists excised the passages that proved the crowds turned against them and demanded his execution when they found out he turned their water into Snapple. . . .

--J.D.

03-17-2004, 09:33 AM	#1
Zucco Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Beautiful, crime-free Flower Mound, TX Posts: 156	Matthew 11:19: Does this say Jesus is a drunk? Matthew 11:19 19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children. Does this verse imply that Jesus drank too much wine or am I misunderstanding the "Son of Man" reference? I find it hard to believe that god incarnate needed a little nip here and there to get through the day.

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03-17-2004, 10:55 AM	#2
funinspace Contributor Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: North West usa Posts: 10,245	It would if you presumed that the people insulting Jesus were being honest and clear. I think a fair understanding of the verse is that the people were being derogatory. You don't even have to be a believer to get to that conclusion. But I would also say that the verse makes it pretty obvious, when considered with the whole NT, that Jesus drank alcohol...Don't tell the Baptists DK

03-17-2004, 01:49 PM	#6
Doctor X Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: USA Posts: 3,794	I remember one trying to argue that "they did not have wine back then, they had grape juice." Sometimes, you just have to laugh. --J.D.

03-17-2004, 10:46 PM	#10
Doctor X Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: USA Posts: 3,794	Indeed, later apologists excised the passages that proved the crowds turned against them and demanded his execution when they found out he turned their water into Snapple. . . . --J.D.

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