gurugeorge

In discussing with ApostateAbe I brought up Neil Godfrey's pointing to similarities between some Hellenistic novelistic tropes and gospel tropes. An idea occurred to me that I wondered as to the plausibility of:

IIRC, it can safely be said that a sizeable minority of educated people of the day (and some not so educated) were members of some kind of Mystery cult or another. Even some quite famous people were initiates.

So far as we know, what went on in those cults was kept fairly well secret - in fact, we still don't really know some of the nitty-gritty of what went on.

In this context, then, the novels are a sort of "cheeky" literary genre - a form of romantic novel that also has a cheeky reference to Mysteries ideas. Something those "in the know" would amusedly acknowledge with a nod-and-a-wink.

So, the gospel writers were attempting to appeal to THIS audience, by couching the story of their Jewish dying/rising saviour deity in the clothing of a format that would be familiar to them.

I also had a similar idea wrt the notion that the Jesus biography follows somewhat the format of a Stoic "exemplary biography" - again, there's a certain target audience in mind here. Philosophically-inclined, educated.

Anyway, I think this all hangs together fairly well in giving a clearer picture of the people who were first appealed to around the time of the writing of the gospels (which I would take to be from 70 CE onwards). Far from aiming at slaves and such, it seems the gospel writers were aiming at educated people who were already initiates in cults, and philosophically-inclined.

But of course this is just my speculation - but I'd be interested to know if anyone has done any work along these lines?

mountainman

The "educated cult" was the Greek priesthood and the top echalons of this priesthood known as the Sacred College of the Pontifices reported to the "Pontifex Maximus" from the time of Julius Caesar, who bribed his way to assume that role in Rome. The educated cult included the philosophical schools who wrote and preserved the literature of the Greek civilisation. You need to perceive that the Roman Emperors sponsored the Greek priesthood and the Greek civilisation in the epoch BCE, in the 1st, in the 2nd, in the 3rd and in the early part of the 4th centuries under Diocletian. Plotinus, discussed earlier, is a good example, since his renown was recognised by the emperors, and since he produced numerous philosophical / metaphysical / religious works which were highly revered by the Greek civilisation, and by his 12 disciples, of whom Porphyry was one. Plotinus' wrote about the concept of the Greek Holy Trinity --- The All or the Good (CHRESTOS), the SPIRIT and the SOUL.

The gospel writers were aiming to convert these educated Greeks away from the Greek Logos, and had absolutely no impact on them until Constantine backed the gospels with his sword.

spamandham

I think Stark has done a reasonably good job of showing that it is very unlikely that Christianity started among slaves and such, but instead most likely started among the upper crust. So this is consistent with what you're suggesting.

Elijah

I agree with the idea that they are trying to present a Greek type of philosopher (or at least influenced) but in a Jewish messiah context.

mountainman

Rabbi Pythagoras and Rabbi Heraclitus one fine morning were engaged in debate on the portico to the Jewish temple about the nature of the Logos .... Yeah it makes perfect sense. NOT. The audience was Greek. The audience was not Jewish.

In accordance to Christian Tradition, the audience consisted of "Gentiles" and conversions were expected --- by the authors or editor(s) or publisher --- of the new testament. We dont know who the authors of the NT were, but we do know who was its first (large-scale) editor and first (large-scale) publisher.

aa5874

Well, based on "Octavius" by Minucius Felix and "Against Celsus" by a writer using the name Origen, the gospels had very little effect on the philosophical inclined.

And when one reads the gospels themselves the authors made Jesus mingle, eat and drink with the poor, the publicans and sinners.

Mark 2.15-17 The authors of the gospels appear to be appealing to the gullible with riddles, hocus-pocus magic, fire and brimstone conflagration, and Holy Ghost stories.

Examine Mark 13. This is not philosophy; this is doomsday material; The end of the WORLD. There would be no need or time for "philosophy". The writers of the Gospels appear to believe the end of world was imminent.

Mark 13.30 So, don't bother with the Stoics, the Platonists, the Peripatetics, the Pythagoreans, the Epicureans and their philosophy just believe in Jesus or else you will be burned to smithereens.

The Gospels were not philosophy, just doomsday riddles for the gullible. In other words, Stop philosophizing and REPENT.

Clivedurdle

Someone mention audiences?
http://www.nazarenus.com/