John A. Broussard

A nice list. I wouldn't have had the patience to look it all up.

I'm saving it for those theists on this forum who point out that I am going to suffer the torments of hell fire for ever and ever and ever. For all of eternity. World without end. Burn, burn, burn---cuz it says so in the bible.

I can still remember the marvelous mural in my parochial kindergarten class which showed sinners burning in hell and the sign above it saying, Toujours rester, jamais partir.

I should mention in passing that I have three different bibles in front of me, each of which uses the word, "hell" in the new testament. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that you aren't mainstream.

Clarice O'C

Diog, I'd have to brush up on this but maybe you know. Isn't the Greek for 'eternal' different from 'everlasting.'? 'Eternal' meaning quality of life in the present so that eternal life and death are both in the present. Eternal death would be 'living death' now. Eternal = chronos or something like that? And everlasting = ?

Clarice O'C

If you use a concordance to look up each instance of 'hell' you'll find the words that Diog has listed, like sheol, gehenna, etc. Then look at the meanings that he has provided. This will give you the context of what is being said about hell in that particular verse.

Diogenes the Cynic

The word is aionios, which is an adjectival form of the noun, aion, which means "age" in the sense of an indeterminate (but finite) amount of time. It was use much the same way as "age" or "era" is used in English. It mean a lifetime (sometimes a person's life was called his "aion") or it could be specific period (like the "age of Alexander").

aionios is an adjectival derivative which does not translate gracefully in English. It could most literally be rendered as something like "age-y" as in an "age-y amount of time." It could be a long time but it doesn't mean eternal or unending. "Enduring," and "age-lasting" are typical examples of how it's translated.

Helpmabob

Hi John - Very, very few. I would be surprised if it were not so: Enter ye in at the strait gate:for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. [Matthew 7:13,14] Their gods they have made with their own hands will not save them: They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good. [Jeremiah 10:5] My God, however has overcome death, and offers me life everlasting, and tangible comfort in the avoidance of Hell. He is worthy of any praise that I can offer Him.

Clarice O'C

Imaginative work on building the mythical Jesus figure along the lines of other god-men stretches way back in time. All developed cultures had at least one. So Israel created a Jewish one for themselves.

Diogenes the Cynic

Helpmabob, the "suffering servant" in Isaiah is a poetic personification of Israel itself. The text explicitly says so. It is not a messianic prophecy.

dancer_rnb

one particular phrase using this word twice is usually translated as forever, though I have seen universalists tranlate it as an age and an age, or age of ages, which again would indicate a VERY LONG time but not one without end. Which makes such a god seem a little less horrific.

John A. Broussard

Please explain why it is that they are convinced that they are right, but that you are also convinced that you are right.

I look forward to your answer. (Don't bother to quote scripture, because the other side does the same thing and draws an opposite conclusion from the same text)

Thanks.

newtype_alpha

Just like to add, according to what I've heard from some Jewish schollars, the duration of a soul's stay in hell is approximately thirteen months long. It's just a very sucky experience (although the souls get relief on the Sabbath so they can praise God) after which they are redeemed and purified.