Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Illusionist · 05-05-2005, 01:16 PM

scientists theorize that time is a product of the big bang, and that there was no time before the big bang. Christians would argue that God is outside of time yet he somehow created the universe. In both cases, wouldnt time be required beforehand? If the universe began at a point, there had to be some point in time when it began to expand. If there was no time in which the big bang occurred, then the universe must always have been, because to say something began would require time. Likewise, if God is outside of time, there would have to be a period in which he created the universe, or else the universe had to always exist or God is not outside of time.

So, in the end the big bang theory is no more credible than the creation story.

TySixtus · 05-05-2005, 01:21 PM

Time is a property of the universe. It doesn't exist outside of the universe. Ergo, "before the universe" is the same as saying "before time."

Ty

Illusionist · 05-05-2005, 01:25 PM

but then when did the universe "decide" to expand? THe universe must always be expanding forever if it didnt start at some point. And to start at a point would imply that the universe wasnt starting at that point before.

spin · 05-05-2005, 01:30 PM

Wrong room, folks.

Life the universe and everything is a few doors down the corridor.

Chris Weimer · 05-05-2005, 01:40 PM

Doesn't this belong in EoG or something? Anyways, the Big Bang was the result of two 12 dimensional structures colliding at a single point to create this eleventh dimensional structure, both of which have time as a property, or this was how it was explained to me by a super-string theorist (amateur nonetheless). Maybe someone can either correct or fill in what I left out.

Illusionist · 05-05-2005, 01:59 PM

Wrong room, folks.

Life the universe and everything is a few doors down the corridor.

Honestly, i dont see why it matters.

Chris Weimer · 05-05-2005, 02:26 PM

because this is specifically for Biblical Criticism and History.

Illusionist · 05-05-2005, 02:31 PM

the creation is in the bible

Amaleq13 · 05-05-2005, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illusionist

the creation is in the bible

While it is true that the creation story (two, actually) is in the Bible, this thread is clearly more about cosmology than Biblical Criticism so...swoosh!

Illusionist · 05-05-2005, 02:38 PM

alright, shut 'er down boys.

05-05-2005, 01:16 PM	#1
Illusionist Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 117	isnt the big bang theory just as unreasonable as a God outside of time scientists theorize that time is a product of the big bang, and that there was no time before the big bang. Christians would argue that God is outside of time yet he somehow created the universe. In both cases, wouldnt time be required beforehand? If the universe began at a point, there had to be some point in time when it began to expand. If there was no time in which the big bang occurred, then the universe must always have been, because to say something began would require time. Likewise, if God is outside of time, there would have to be a period in which he created the universe, or else the universe had to always exist or God is not outside of time. So, in the end the big bang theory is no more credible than the creation story.

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05-05-2005, 01:21 PM	#2
TySixtus Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Rachacha NY Posts: 4,219	Time is a property of the universe. It doesn't exist outside of the universe. Ergo, "before the universe" is the same as saying "before time." Ty

05-05-2005, 01:25 PM	#3
Illusionist Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 117	but then when did the universe "decide" to expand? THe universe must always be expanding forever if it didnt start at some point. And to start at a point would imply that the universe wasnt starting at that point before.

05-05-2005, 01:30 PM	#4
spin Contributor Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: nowhere Posts: 15,747	Wrong room, folks. Life the universe and everything is a few doors down the corridor.

05-05-2005, 01:40 PM	#5
Chris Weimer Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: none Posts: 9,879	Doesn't this belong in EoG or something? Anyways, the Big Bang was the result of two 12 dimensional structures colliding at a single point to create this eleventh dimensional structure, both of which have time as a property, or this was how it was explained to me by a super-string theorist (amateur nonetheless). Maybe someone can either correct or fill in what I left out.

05-05-2005, 01:59 PM	#6
Illusionist Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 117	Wrong room, folks. Life the universe and everything is a few doors down the corridor. Honestly, i dont see why it matters.

05-05-2005, 02:26 PM	#7
Chris Weimer Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: none Posts: 9,879	because this is specifically for Biblical Criticism and History.

05-05-2005, 02:31 PM	#8
Illusionist Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 117	the creation is in the bible

05-05-2005, 02:38 PM	#10
Illusionist Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 117	alright, shut 'er down boys.

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