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Old 04-01-2005, 07:04 PM   #1
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Default Bible & Koran scholars

Can you give me chapter and verse of some of the good moral teachings in the Bible or the Koran that are NOT god-based? You know, like the "turn the other cheek", or the "thou shalt not kill", stuff like that? TIA
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Old 04-02-2005, 08:36 AM   #2
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Actually all the moral teachings of the Hebrew Bible are God based. The origin of the commandment to love one's neighbor is Leviticus 19:18 "Thou shalt not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD." IOW according to the Bible the reason to treat people in a certain way is that God commands it, not because it does good unto the neighbor.
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Old 04-02-2005, 11:37 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anat
IOW according to the Bible the reason to treat people in a certain way is that God commands it, not because it does good unto the neighbor.
Ehhh...I think you are imposing an outlook on the Biblical text which the authors did not have. I think they saw your two options as identical.

What I mean is, doing God's will and doing good were inseparable in their minds. Hence they would say that you can only do good to your neighbor insofar as you are doing what God commands, and vice versa.

So as regards the OP question,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alter
Can you give me chapter and verse of some of the good moral teachings in the Bible or the Koran that are NOT god-based?
There are none because the authors would not have even understood what you mean by "not God-based".

But I think I understand what it is you're looking for, Alter. Exodus 20 has the "Ten Commandments", Matt 5-7 is the Sermon on the Mount, and the whole Book of Proverbs might come in handy.

I'm not qualified to comment on the Quran.
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Old 04-02-2005, 04:48 PM   #4
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Ahem, the first 3-4 commandments (depends on who does the counting) are between man and creator, not between man and neighbor.

Look at this compilation of the 613 commandments in the Hebrew Bible. They are divided by topic and all refer to the verse on which they are based. Relevant subtopics are:
Love and Brotherhood
The Poor and Unfortunate
Treatment of Gentiles
Business Practices
Employees, Servants and Slaves
The Court and Judicial Procedure
Injuries and Damages
Property and Property Rights
Criminal Laws
Punishment and Restitution

Also some of the family law can be relevant in a secular context as well.
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Old 04-02-2005, 07:32 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anat
Ahem, the first 3-4 commandments (depends on who does the counting) are between man and creator, not between man and neighbor.

Look at this compilation of the 613 commandments in the Hebrew Bible. They are divided by topic and all refer to the verse on which they are based. Relevant subtopics are:
Love and Brotherhood
The Poor and Unfortunate
Treatment of Gentiles
Business Practices
Employees, Servants and Slaves
The Court and Judicial Procedure
Injuries and Damages
Property and Property Rights
Criminal Laws
Punishment and Restitution

Also some of the family law can be relevant in a secular context as well.
beautiful! Exactly what I was looking for.

Anyone have similar links for the Koran?
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