Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Tellurian · 11-21-2003, 05:35 PM

But what about the other Jesuses (or is it Jesi), namely Yeshu ben Pantera and Ben Stada? And isn't there another one who lived in the first century BCE and escaped to Alexandria during the Pharisee persecutions? Maybe there are even more?

Toto · 11-21-2003, 06:21 PM

21 Jesus's

Quote:

The name Jesus appears frequently in the writings of the Jewish historian Josephus. In the Loeb edition of his works the index lists this name no less than twenty-one times referring to different persons, and it is one of the most common names in the index. . . .

The books of Josephus appeared in Greek, and we give the list of names in their Greek form, as given in the index or in the text:

Jesus son of Naue
Jesus son of Saul
Jesus, high priest, son of Phineas
Jesus son of the high priest Jozadak
Jesus son of Joiada
Jesus, high priest, son of Simon
Jesus, high priest, son of Phabes
Jesus, high priest, son of Seee
Jesus the Christ
Jesus son of Damnaeus, became high priest
Jesus son of Gamliel, became high priest
Jesus son of Sapphas
Jesus, chief priest, probably to be identified with 10 or 11
Jesus son of Gamalas, high priest
Jesus, brigand chief on borderland of Ptolemais
Jesus son of Sapphias
Jesus brother of Chares
Jesus a Galilean, perhaps to be identified with 15
Jesus in ambuscade, perhaps to be identified with 16
Jesus, priest, son of Thebuthi
Jesus son of Ananias, rude peasant, prophesies the fall of Jerusalem

mark9950 · 11-22-2003, 12:36 AM

Quote:

The name Jesus appears frequently in the writings of the Jewish historian Josephus.

21 jesii thats more than the amount of elvii my goodness what a mess of spaghetti.

Now toto who is the one written in the NT?or were there many written about?How do we clean up the mess of tangled spaghetti,

rlogan · 11-22-2003, 03:56 AM

Toto - that was very interesting link. Thanks.

Quite a blow to the TF crowd, IMHO.

No tangled pasta Mark. Myth drawn from multiple sources.

Toto · 11-22-2003, 11:42 AM

I recommend Leidner's book (see this) although he does get off on some speculations that go beyond the possibility of proof.

Leider thinks that the NT Jesus is based on the OT Joshua son of Nun (Jesus is the Greek for the Hebrew Joshua.)

For another Jesus, see this thread: Two Jesuses: Weeden on XTALK, where it is opined that some aspects of Jesus are based on the crazy Jesus son of Ananias.

11-22-2003, 12:29 PM

That would all make sense if Jesus was the name given to the new identity of Joseph after the son of man was born unto him by means of rebirth. Hence, the two Jesus' of which one was married when the adam nature referred to as Jesus bar Joseph took the eve nature here called Magdalene to be his wife. It is in this sense that they were married and it is only in this sense that they were married.

I should add here that the son of man identity here called Jesus -Bar Abbas was the true identity of the man called Joseph who was a carpenter and therefore co-creater with the creator here reborn.

rlogan · 11-22-2003, 03:08 PM

Toto - Thanks again. You did a nice review of that, and I'm going to get it.

In my own mind, I had been forming the "composite" Jesus picture. Having so many with that name certainly bolsters this approach.

I would have to agree that once the "witnesses" (The Bible, the Church "Fathers, etc") have been impeached so many times the burden of proof for the veracity of Acts is upon the apologists.

Amos - I am curious if you have made up your own school of thought and terminology - or is there some existing school of thought you are following?

mark9950 · 11-22-2003, 03:09 PM

Quote:

where it is opined that some aspects of Jesus are based on the crazy Jesus son of Ananias.

That would make sense because of the incident of cursing the fig tree when he knew figs were out of season.

Scourging the people in the temple.

Thinking he was a god.

This is sure signs of a crazy man.

mark9950 · 11-22-2003, 03:13 PM

Quote:

No tangled pasta Mark. Myth drawn from multiple sources.

Definately.

11-22-2003, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rlogan

Amos - I am curious if you have made up your own school of thought and terminology - or is there some existing school of thought you are following?

No, rlogan, it's not my own school of thought but it is not so that I follow someone elses thoughts. It is just that I recognize my thoughts in the bible and that is why I present it that way.

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11-21-2003, 05:35 PM	#11
Tellurian Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: California Posts: 93	But what about the other Jesuses (or is it Jesi), namely Yeshu ben Pantera and Ben Stada? And isn't there another one who lived in the first century BCE and escaped to Alexandria during the Pharisee persecutions? Maybe there are even more?

11-22-2003, 03:56 AM	#14
rlogan Banned Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,159	Toto - that was very interesting link. Thanks. Quite a blow to the TF crowd, IMHO. No tangled pasta Mark. Myth drawn from multiple sources.

11-22-2003, 11:42 AM	#15
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	I recommend Leidner's book (see this) although he does get off on some speculations that go beyond the possibility of proof. Leider thinks that the NT Jesus is based on the OT Joshua son of Nun (Jesus is the Greek for the Hebrew Joshua.) For another Jesus, see this thread: Two Jesuses: Weeden on XTALK, where it is opined that some aspects of Jesus are based on the crazy Jesus son of Ananias.

11-22-2003, 12:29 PM	#16
Amos Guest Posts: n/a	That would all make sense if Jesus was the name given to the new identity of Joseph after the son of man was born unto him by means of rebirth. Hence, the two Jesus' of which one was married when the adam nature referred to as Jesus bar Joseph took the eve nature here called Magdalene to be his wife. It is in this sense that they were married and it is only in this sense that they were married. I should add here that the son of man identity here called Jesus -Bar Abbas was the true identity of the man called Joseph who was a carpenter and therefore co-creater with the creator here reborn.

11-22-2003, 03:08 PM	#17
rlogan Banned Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,159	Toto - Thanks again. You did a nice review of that, and I'm going to get it. In my own mind, I had been forming the "composite" Jesus picture. Having so many with that name certainly bolsters this approach. I would have to agree that once the "witnesses" (The Bible, the Church "Fathers, etc") have been impeached so many times the burden of proof for the veracity of Acts is upon the apologists. Amos - I am curious if you have made up your own school of thought and terminology - or is there some existing school of thought you are following?

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