Magus55

And what makes you think that represents Christianity or Jesus' teachings? Building a 10 million dollar church is disgusting, and I'm sure Jesus is shaking His head in disappointment over it. If you need a church, build one with wood, for a few thousand dollars, instead of one with 25 ton gold inlaid doors. I fully agree that is unChristian and wrong. But that doesn't represent Christianity. What religious organization do you think sponsers the most expensive buildings and "investments" ? The Catholic Church, which is another reason I think its heretical. The RCC wants nothing more than more money. They aren't out to bring anyone to Christ, only to raise finances to fund the Pope's mansion.

Lanakila

10 million dollars sounds like an exhorbent amount of money, but if the building doesn't have gold doors but is big enough to hold 3000+ people on any given sunday, and has a gym and other facilities that really isn't as much as y'all think. I was a member of a mega church, that owes alot of money for the building it's in, but they aren't wasting as far as I can tell. Once a church reaches a certain size, it has no place to go but bigger, as far as I have experienced.

I know it's wasteful in the sense that they are preaching something that is untrue and inaccurate, but people do believe it, and they go to listen, and take their families. They give their money freely for the most part. (I have heard tithing sermons though)

Heathen Dawn

Houses of God are a waste of money. “The hands that help are better than the lips that pray”, as Ingersoll said. Prayer and praise of God does not require a lavish building, it can be done at a believer’s home, or outdoors if space is insufficient.

mark9950

Of course they are they could just either rent a hall or gymnasium or build a gymnasium from the general steel corporation for 100k without the gold trim.

But of course when it is not out of the pastors pocket he feels as long as it is in jesus name it is ok.That goes for pastors salary too.

mark9950

:notworthy :notworthy :notworthy

Lanakila

Like I tell folks all the time, classifying folks gets you into trouble. Not everyone fits into the mold you put them into. Most churches have checks and balances and committes, and even allow the members to vote before huge decisions and expenses are added.

I am sorry you have such a bad taste in your mouth for pastors, and churches, but they aren't that bad if they stay out of politics IMO.

AJ113

Referring to the OP.
The topic is one that I have brought up on this forum previously. Let us look at the facts: Jesus clearly tells us to ask for anything in his name and it will be granted. These are the words of Jesus himself, so there is no need to cross reference them with the words of his followers.

Note that the promise is completely unconditional. All conditions that have been attached to this promise have been created by christians who know that they have to tie themselves in knots on order to justify it.

The fact is: the promise is a bare-faced lie.

After 40 years of christianity I can verify that it simply is not true. It does not work. It has never worked. It is nonsense.

Now children, what does that tell us about the bible?

mark9950

I believe that it is a lie because of the hypocrasy of christianity.

As stated in the book of james


James 2:15-17 (NRSV)

15If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, 16and one of you says to them, ‘Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,’ and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that? 17So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.

I never thought of it this way before but this tread made me realize that jesus may have had too much trust in his followers that would have made him make that statement.I may have the conclusion jesus was referring to his followers when he may have made that statement.

It sounds too me that christianity does not care about anyone but themselves including MANY CHRISTIANS.

When I went to church when I was a christian I was out of work and told many people.You would think many people would be trying to do something to help me.No dice they were very selfish and did not care of even telling me anything about job openings or anything like that.

I did not ask anyone to give me a free ride,maybe they could pull some strings for me or something at least.No dice.

Magus55

Jesus said anything you ask in my name and believe, you will receive. There are two conditions present, so no its not unconditional. Asking in Jesus' name, means under His authority. If Jesus wouldn't ask for it, you aren't asking in His name, so why would you expect to receieve it? And second, if you believe. It takes an incredible amount of faith to truly believe that what you ask, you will receive. We always have doubts.

During your 40 years as a so-called "Christian", what did you ask God for?

Calzaer

So would Jesus NOT ask for starving children to be fed?

I suppose since he WOULD ask for figs to grow on fig trees out-of-season to feed HIMSELF, he might ask something similar for small children.

Then again, he'd rather use his miraculous powers to smite the fig tree rather than have it grow figs, so maybe we'd be better off praying for him to smite the starving children.