Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 03-28-2011, 07:10 PM

Furthermore, he's not naked!

Minimalist · 03-28-2011, 08:33 PM

You are correct, Sweetpea. The Talpiot Tomb was one of Jacobovici's brain farts.

http://www.joezias.com/talpiot.htm

(Mr. Zias was curator of the Israel Antiquities Authority when the tomb was first found and inventoried in 1980 by Amos Kloner.)

Steve Weiss · 03-28-2011, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetpea7

Yeah, didn't Jacobovici team up with James Cameron a few years back for a "documentary" claiming to have found the tomb of Jesus which was quickly discredited? Also, why is this guy's show titled "The Naked Archaeologist" when he is a journalist and has no training in archaeology?

I don't get it. How could there be a tomb of Jesus (fictional though he is) if, according to Christian doctrine, he bodily ascended into heaven to sit on the right hand (god has all the normal human features) of god? So, if the "real" tomb were found, there was no resurrection??

Toto · 03-28-2011, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Weiss

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetpea7

Yeah, didn't Jacobovici team up with James Cameron a few years back for a "documentary" claiming to have found the tomb of Jesus which was quickly discredited? Also, why is this guy's show titled "The Naked Archaeologist" when he is a journalist and has no training in archaeology?

I don't get it. How could there be a tomb of Jesus (fictional though he is) if, according to Christian doctrine, he bodily ascended into heaven to sit on the right hand (god has all the normal human features) of god? So, if the "real" tomb were found, there was no resurrection??

That's right, and this theory is not favored by orthodox Christians. James Tabor, professor of religious studies at Duke University, is the author of The Jesus Dynasty: The Hidden History of Jesus, His Royal Family, and the Birth of Christianity (or via: amazon.co.uk) (website here), which speculates that Jesus was of royal blood, and his brother James succeeded him in the early church. I have forgotten the details, but the hypothesis has not gained much traction. Tabor himself seems to consider himself a godfearer - he thinks that Judaism is the true religion, but he has chosen to be a righteous gentile rather than convert.

See Talpiot Tomb for details.

Doug Shaver · 03-29-2011, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Weiss

So, if the "real" tomb were found, there was no resurrection??

That depends. When they find the tomb, it will be empty, if there was a resurrection. If there's a body in it, then Christianity is in deep doo-doo.

Steve Weiss · 03-29-2011, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Weiss

I don't get it. How could there be a tomb of Jesus (fictional though he is) if, according to Christian doctrine, he bodily ascended into heaven to sit on the right hand (god has all the normal human features) of god? So, if the "real" tomb were found, there was no resurrection??

That's right, and this theory is not favored by orthodox Christians. James Tabor, professor of religious studies at Duke University, is the author of The Jesus Dynasty: The Hidden History of Jesus, His Royal Family, and the Birth of Christianity (or via: amazon.co.uk) (website here), which speculates that Jesus was of royal blood, and his brother James succeeded him in the early church. I have forgotten the details, but the hypothesis has not gained much traction. Tabor himself seems to consider himself a godfearer - he thinks that Judaism is the true religion, but he has chosen to be a righteous gentile rather than convert.

See Talpiot Tomb for details.

If Judaism is the one true religion, then heaven help us. That's a very low truth standard, indeed.

Steve Weiss · 03-29-2011, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug Shaver

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Weiss

So, if the "real" tomb were found, there was no resurrection??

That depends. When they find the tomb, it will be empty, if there was a resurrection. If there's a body in it, then Christianity is in deep doo-doo.

I know that the burial cave of that Jesus guy was supposed to be empty when a couple of Roman soldiers took the night off when god arose, but why have a tomb if it is empty and the resurrection had already taken place? Is there some logic here? None that I notice.

Toto · 03-29-2011, 09:14 AM

The Talpiot "tomb" is actually a burial place of ossuaries, so if this was Jesus' ossuary, he died and after a year his bones were placed in the ossuary. It is in fact totally incompatible with the empty tomb of the gospels.

Steve Weiss · 03-29-2011, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

The Talpiot "tomb" is actually a burial place of ossuaries, so if this was Jesus' ossuary, he died and after a year his bones were placed in the ossuary. It is in fact totally incompatible with the empty tomb of the gospels.

So, if they find the real Jesus bones, Christianity is off? Hope they find them.

Doug Shaver · 03-30-2011, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Weiss

Is there some logic here?

It's a religious dogma. Hello.

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03-28-2011, 07:10 PM	#11
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Furthermore, he's not naked!

03-28-2011, 08:33 PM	#12
Minimalist Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,808	You are correct, Sweetpea. The Talpiot Tomb was one of Jacobovici's brain farts. http://www.joezias.com/talpiot.htm (Mr. Zias was curator of the Israel Antiquities Authority when the tomb was first found and inventoried in 1980 by Amos Kloner.)

03-29-2011, 09:14 AM	#18
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	The Talpiot "tomb" is actually a burial place of ossuaries, so if this was Jesus' ossuary, he died and after a year his bones were placed in the ossuary. It is in fact totally incompatible with the empty tomb of the gospels.

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