Enda80

The Biblical Jesus is quite childish when dealing with his enemies. Were 1st century Judaists that childish then? There were (I am told) about twenty sects of Judaism then. Do we have records of their polemics against each other?

Diogenes the Cynic

Could you explain what you mean by "childish?"

Metacrock

I think Jesus when he deals with enemies is one of the coolest people recorded in human history. No one esle anywhere in any time deals with enemies that way.

(1)He doesn't hurt any of them (did you notice that?) He turns over some tables, that's the wrost thing he did.

(2) He dosen't curse them or curse at them.

(3) He's either kryptic in his insults, baffles them with Rabbinical schtick, or just remains silent--something most people rarely think to do.


As Doctor who (Tom Baker) once said "What's the value of being an Adult if you can't be childish?"

Enda80

Matthew 21:12-13; Mark 11:15-17; Luke 19:45-46; John 2:13-22

Let me explain why the temple incident serves as a childish example. The temple was where, according to the Hebrew Bible, one had to sacrifice animals for Passover. Pilgrims from other lands had to buy animals for the sacrifice, since the animal had to be unblemished, and you could not bring one from Egypt or Rome without it almost certainly getting damaged. However, the temple authorities would not accept Roman money, since the Roman emperor was worshipped as a god by many people. So, the temple authorities had money changers to exchange the offending money for acceptable coinage.

It is hard to imagine what the Biblical Jesus wants done to improve things. How did he think the temple could function without people paying for the animals that the Hebrew Bible itself said had to be sacrificed there? Did he think people should pay with Roman money?

Also, the Temple was the size of a football field, so the Biblical Jesus had to have fought with the guards if he was able to throw out all of the money changers and make it so that nobody could carry anything through the temple.

http://www.nobeliefs.com/DarkBible/darkbible6.htm
Christ's Temper
"And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables; And said unto them that sold doves, 'Take these things hence; make not my Father's house a house of merchandise.'" (John 2:14-16)

Comment
Here we have Jesus' temper and violence showing. It must have taken considerable fortitude to drive all the moneychangers out and then have the nerve to pour their money out and turn over their tables. Consider what would happen today if a man entered a Church bake sale and threw everyone out and violently turned over the tables. No doubt the police would come and throw him in the slammer.

Metacrock

(1) The issue was probably not that they had money changers, bu that the changers were ripping people off. Maybe they even bid on slots and had kickbacks.

(2) Ties in with OT allusions

(3) Might have something to do with the illegitimacy of the preisthood post Macabees. That's if I'm right about Jesus being affiliated with Essene interests.


Do you normally see acts of social protest as childish? Do you think Ghandi was an idiot?





Of course.That's when he did his southern mantis techique. I'm sure he also threw in some xian xan and some white Crain and southern Hung Gar. That's the stuff he learned while traveling through china in the lost years. Can't you see Jesus jumping around the temple like Jackie Chan?

http://www.nobeliefs.com/DarkBible/darkbible6.htm
Christ's Temper
"And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables; And said unto them that sold doves, 'Take these things hence; make not my Father's house a house of merchandise.'" (John 2:14-16)


Bull! Doesn't say he hurt anyone. Valid from of non violent Civil Disobedience.

Enda80

Hell raising

The character Jesus had such selfishness and intolerance that he demanded belief from others or else he threatened them with eternal damnation:

Whosoever shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.

-Mark 3:29 (KJV)



The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

-Matthew 13:41-42



And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

-Matthew 25:46 (KJV)



...except ye repent ye shall all likewise perish.

-Luke 13:3 (KJV)



Ye serpents, ye generations of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

-Matthew 23:33 (KJV)

Anyone who uses threats in this manner gives no indication of tolerance, humility or forgiveness, and thus, deserves no admiration.
Name calling

Many think of Jesus in a gentle and loving sense. Yet he gives vehement examples of name calling:

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

-Matthew 23:14 (KJV)



Ye fools and blind:...

-Matthew 23:17 (KJV)



Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

-John 8:44 (KJV)



O generation of vipers! how can ye, being evil, speak good things?

-Matthew 12:34 (KJV)



. . .If I should say I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you. . .

-John 8:55 (KJV)



Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward parts is full of ravening and wickedness.

-Luke 11:39 (KJV)
http://www.nobeliefs.com/jesus.htm

Enda80

Also, the Temple was the size of a football field, so the Biblical Jesus had to have fought with the guards (the temple had armed guards) if he was able to throw out all of the money changers and make it so that nobody could carry anything through the temple. After all, any armed guards would have quickly stopped someone going nuts immediately.

johntheapostate

Surely you cant be as deluded as you appear from your writings. You would actually need the Gospels to spell it out to you that Jesus actually hurt someone before you would admit that Jesus could not have drove out multiple grown men defending large sums of money along with the temple guards by only waving his scourge in the air and yelling like a madman. Then walk away unmolested by anyone.

Enda80

Okay, got out Bart D. Ehrman's book Jesus Apocalyitc Prophet.

Anyway, some other childish Jews

whoever wrote Jeremiah 7
people in the Qumran community
whoever composed commentary on Habakkuk
Assumption of Moses
Jesus son of Ananias (maybe)

Anat

Just read Jeremiah 7. What about it do you find childish?