Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Sheshbazzar · 03-14-2007, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto
Briefly, the Hebrew "Joshua" (Yoshua) became the Aramaic "Yeshua." Greek does not have the 'sh' sound, so Yeshua became Iesous, with a Greek ending.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheshbazzar

So does that indicate that it is impossible for Greek speakers to "frame to pronounce [it] right"?- Judges 12:6

Quote:

Jdg 12:6 Then said they unto him, Say now Shibboleth: and he said Sibboleth: for he could not frame to pronounce [it] right. Then they took him, and slew him at the passages of Jordan: and there fell at that time of the Ephraimites forty and two thousand.

It is interesting just how differently the Septuagint renders this particular verse, and this particular "pass" word.
Forty and two thousand men found forty and two thousand excuses to NOT frame to pronounce it right.

Ah, but the childern of Ephraimites and of the Manassites were more numerous than the Gileadites, wherefore it was thought that their word, and their pronunciation would prevail.
Follow the majority, and speak and write the "sibboleth" of the majority if you will; after all what possible difference could it make?
Time will tell.

xaxxat · 03-15-2007, 04:09 AM

I thought his name was supposed to be Emmanuel...

:Cheeky:

Julian · 03-15-2007, 05:24 AM

In addition to the Jude/Judas phenomenon which, I suppose, is somewhat understandable, given the view of history upon Judas, I will point out the more mysterious James/Jacob. James is actually Jacob in the NT, specifically Ἰάκωβος. In english history, when there was talk about putting James the Third on the english throne, those who supported such a move (or supported the James line of kings) were called Jacobites, an allusion to the proper reading and translation of the NT.

Julian

Sheshbazzar · 03-15-2007, 07:43 AM

How is "Shibboleth" pronounced in Greek? :banghead:

gstafleu · 03-15-2007, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S.C.Carlson

Owing to the popularity of theophoric names, I'd be surprised if a would be messiah didn't have an appropriate name.

In addition, the original Joshua was a big hero, to wit the one who carried out the ethnic cleansing of Canaan. Given that this helped the Israelites to gain the "promised land," a name like "God saves" is appropriate for such a hero. Having said that, if the cleansing Joshua had had some other name, say Radovan, well, then maybe Jesus would have been called Radovan as well. This is assuming that Jesus' name is in significant part a tribute to the original Joshua, of course.

Gerard Stafleu

Malachi151 · 03-15-2007, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstafleu

In addition, the original Joshua was a big hero, to wit the one who carried out the ethnic cleansing of Canaan. Given that this helped the Israelites to gain the "promised land," a name like "God saves" is appropriate for such a hero. Having said that, if the cleansing Joshua had had some other name, say Radovan, well, then maybe Jesus would have been called Radovan as well. This is assuming that Jesus' name is in significant part a tribute to the original Joshua, of course.

Gerard Stafleu

Well, either way. If Radovan was "Joshua's" name then Radovan would have been popular in the 1st century, instead of "Jesus".

gstafleu · 03-15-2007, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

Well, either way. If Radovan was "Joshua's" name then Radovan would have been popular in the 1st century, instead of "Jesus".

Correct. But "Radovan" does not mean "God saves." So what I'm getting at here is that the meaning of the name may not have been more than a convenient bonus if they were going for the hero. Having said that, it is very convenient.

Gerard Stafleu

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

03-15-2007, 04:09 AM	#12
xaxxat Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Space Station 33 Posts: 2,543	I thought his name was supposed to be Emmanuel... :Cheeky:

03-15-2007, 05:24 AM	#13
Julian Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Washington, DC (formerly Denmark) Posts: 3,789	In addition to the Jude/Judas phenomenon which, I suppose, is somewhat understandable, given the view of history upon Judas, I will point out the more mysterious James/Jacob. James is actually Jacob in the NT, specifically Ἰάκωβος. In english history, when there was talk about putting James the Third on the english throne, those who supported such a move (or supported the James line of kings) were called Jacobites, an allusion to the proper reading and translation of the NT. Julian

03-15-2007, 07:43 AM	#14
Sheshbazzar Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: On the path of knowledge Posts: 8,889	How is "Shibboleth" pronounced in Greek? :banghead:

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.