Toto

Citation?

aa5874

First of all "Confusion of Tongues" attributed to Philo has nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus of the NT or a Celestial Jesus it is about the confusion of languages in the Jewish Fable about the Tower of Bable.

Secondly, there is no mention whatsoever of Jesus of Nazareth, Joshua or Jeshua the son of Josedec in Philo's "Confusion of Tongues.

Third, the phrase "Behold, a man whose name is the East!" is NOT in Zechariah 6.12 but "Behold, the man whose name is the Branch"

Philo's "Confusion of Tongues"Zechariah 6:12 RSV Again, you are isolating an ambiguous phrase which has nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus of Nazareth, or Joshua the son of Josedec and taking it completely out of context to impose some other meaning.

Zechariah 6.12 clearly states that the man whose name is the Branch shall build the Temple and Joshua the son of Josedec did helo to build the Jewish Temple in Hebrew Scripture.

Philo did NOT attest that Joshua was a Celestial High Priest--Philo never mentioned Joshua the son of Josedec at all.

stephan huller

Do you remember aa when I was mentioning your lack of training in another thread? Things you should know before putting foot in mouth. anatole = tsemach. This has been discussed many times in this thread.

Duvduv

The word used is not netzer but tsemach, which does not mean branch. In any case since Philo was in church hands rather than Jewish ones, there is no wsy of knowing whether any of those writings were authentic.

stephan huller

How is it possible to continue this discussion with people like this participating?

Duvduv

Perhaps you could get past your prejudice and intolerance and explain what is actually bothering you.

aa5874

This is precisely why I do NOT accept your personal translations. Yoiu don't seem to understand that there are trained professional translators. I don't need ad hoc translations.

Again, we have many, many, many translations of Zechariah 6.12 and NONE-ZERO contain the word EAST.

See http://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Zechariah%206:12


1. Zechariah 6:12 (KJ21)
12 and speak unto him, saying, ‘Thus speaketh the Lord of hosts, saying, “Behold the Man whose name is The Branch! And He shall grow up out of His place, and He shall build the temple of the Lord.

2. Zechariah 6:12 (ASV)
12 and speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh Jehovah of hosts, saying, Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: and he shall grow up out of his place; and he shall build the temple of Jehovah;

3. Zechariah 6:12 (AMP)
12 And say to him, Thus says the Lord of hosts: [You, Joshua] behold (look at, keep in sight, watch) the Man [the Messiah] whose name is the Branch, for He shall grow up in His place and He shall build the [true] temple of the Lord.

4. Zechariah 6:12 (CEB)
12 Say to him,
“The Lord of heavenly forces proclaims:
Here is a man.
His name is Branch, and he will branch out from his place;
he will build the Lord’s temple.

5. Zechariah 6:12 (CJB)
12 and tell him, ‘Adonai-Tzva’ot says: “There is coming a man whose name is Tzemach [Sprout]. He will sprout up from his place and rebuild the temple of Adonai.

6. Zechariah 6:12-13 (CEV)
12-13 Tell him that I, the Lord All-Powerful, say, “Someone will reach out from here like a branch and build a temple for me. I will name him ‘Branch,’ and he will rule with royal honors. A priest will stand beside his throne, and the two of them will be good friends.

7. Zechariah 6:12 (DARBY)
12 and speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh Jehovah of hosts, saying, Behold a man whose name is [the] Branch; and he shall grow up from his own place, and he shall build the temple of Jehovah:

8. Zechariah 6:12 (DRA) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 And thou shalt speak to him, saying: Thus saith the Lord of hosts, saying: BEHOLD A MAN, THE ORIENT IS HIS NAME: and under him shall he spring up, and shall build a temple to the Lord.
Zechariah 6:12 (ERV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then tell him this is what the Lord All-Powerful says:

‘There is a man called the Branch.
He will grow strong,
and he will build the Lord’S Temple.

9. Zechariah 6:12 (ESV)
12 And say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall branch out from his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

10. Zechariah 6:12 (ESVUK)
12 And say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall branch out from his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

11. Zechariah 6:12 (EXB)
12 Tell him this is what the Lord ·All-Powerful [Almighty; of Heaven’s Armies; T of hosts] says: ‘A man whose name is the Branch [3:8] will branch out from where he is, and he will build the Temple of the Lord.

12. Zechariah 6:12 (GW) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then say to him, ‘This is what the Lord of Armies says: Here is the man whose name is Branch. He will branch out from where he is, and he will rebuild the Lord’s temple.

13. Zechariah 6:12 (GNT) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him that the Lord Almighty says, ‘The man who is called The Branch will flourish where he is and rebuild the Lord's Temple.

14. Zechariah 6:12 (HCSB) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 You are to tell him: This is what the Lord of Hosts says: Here is a man whose name is Branch; He will branch out from His place and build the Lord’s temple.

15. Zechariah 6:12 (KJV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the Lord of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The Branch; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord:

16. Zacharias 6:12 (KNOX) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 This message thou shalt give him from the Lord God of hosts: Here is one takes his name from the Dayspring; where his feet have trodden, spring there shall be. He it is shall rebuild the Lord’s temple;

17. Zechariah 6:12 (LEB) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 And say to him, ‘Thus says Yahweh of hosts: “Look, here is a man whose name is Branch, and from his place he will sprout, and he will build the temple of Yahweh.

18. Zechariah 6:9-12 (MSG) | In Context | Whole Chapter
A Man Named Branch

9-12 Then this Message from God came to me: “Take up a collection from the exiles. Target Heldai, Tobiah, and Jedaiah. They’ve just arrived from Babylon. You’ll find them at the home of Josiah son of Zephaniah. Collect silver and gold from them and fashion crowns. Place one on the head of Joshua son of Jehozadak, the high priest, and give him this message:

12-13 “‘A Message from God-of-the-Angel-Armies. Be alert. We have a man here whose name is Branch. He will branch out from where he is and build the Temple of God. Yes, he’s the one. He’ll build the Temple of God. Then he’ll assume the role of royalty, take his place on the throne and rule—a priest sitting on the throne!—showing that king and priest can coexist in harmony.’

19. Zechariah 6:12 (NASB) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, a man whose name is Branch, for He will branch out from where He is; and He will build the temple of the Lord.

20. Zechariah 6:12 (NCV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him this is what the Lord All-Powerful says: ‘A man whose name is the Branch will branch out from where he is, and he will build the Temple of the Lord.

21. Zechariah 6:12 (NET) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then say to him, ‘The Lord who rules over all says, “Look—here is the man whose name is Branch, who will sprout up from his place and build the temple of the Lord.

22. Zechariah 6:12 (NIRV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 “Give Jeshua a message from the Lord who rules over all. He says, ‘Here is the man whose name is The Branch. He will branch out and build my temple.

23. Zechariah 6:12 (NIV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him this is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the Lord.

24. Zechariah 6:12 (NIV1984) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him this is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the Lord.

25. Zechariah 6:12 (NIVUK) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him this is what the Lord Almighty says: “Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the Lord.

26. Zechariah 6:12 (NKJV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then speak to him, saying, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, saying:

“Behold, the Man whose name is the BRANCH!
From His place He shall branch out,
And He shall build the temple of the Lord;

27. Zechariah 6:12 (NLV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Then tell him, ‘The Lord of All says, “See, the man whose name is the Branch, for He will branch out from where He is. And He will build the house of the Lord.

28. Zechariah 6:12 (NLT) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him, ‘This is what the Lord of Heaven’s Armies says: Here is the man called the Branch. He will branch out from where he is and build the Temple of the Lord.

29. Zechariah 6:12 (NRSV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 say to him: Thus says the Lord of hosts: Here is a man whose name is Branch: for he shall branch out in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

30. Zechariah 6:12 (NRSVA) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 say to him: Thus says the Lord of hosts: Here is a man whose name is Branch: for he shall branch out in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

31. Zechariah 6:12 (NRSVACE) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 say to him: Thus says the Lord of hosts: Here is a man whose name is Branch: for he shall branch out in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

32. Zechariah 6:12 (NRSVCE) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 say to him: Thus says the Lord of hosts: Here is a man whose name is Branch: for he shall branch out in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

33. Zechariah 6:12 (RSV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall grow up in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

34. Zechariah 6:12 (RSVCE) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, “Behold, the man whose name is the Branch: for he shall grow up in his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord.

35. Zechariah 6:12 (TNIV) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 Tell him this is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the Lord.

36. Zechariah 6:12 (WYC) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 and shalt speak to him, and say, The Lord of hosts saith these things, saying, Lo! a man, Coming forth, either Born, is his name, and under him it shall spring. And he shall build a temple to the Lord, (and shalt speak to him, and say, The Lord of hosts saith these things, saying, Lo! a man whose name is The Branch shall come forth, and shall spring up. And he shall rebuild the Temple of the Lord,)

37. Zechariah 6:12 (YLT) | In Context | Whole Chapter
12 and hast spoken unto him, saying: Thus spake Jehovah of Hosts, saying: Lo, a man! A Shoot -- [is] his name, And from his place he doth shoot up, And he hath built the temple of Jehovah.

stephan huller

I didn't know what to say to spin. I really don't know what to say here. aa, do you think the book of Zechariah was originally written in English? I feel this is a little like the science fiction movie where people travel to the edge of the galaxy and meet blue hominids speaking perfect English. All I can say is - really? Really? Really?

Toto

Psst aa5874 -- there it is - "ORIENT" = east

spin

It was very easy. You were supposed to say whether you thought there is a semantic link between the person who is crowned in 6:11 and the naming in 6:12 of tsemach or not. If not, you needed to explain who it is the man the reader is supposed to behold (הנה איש) whose name is tsemach, because for some reason you refuse to look at what is to me the obvious linguistic connection. That is what was expected of you: read the actual text--that's where you start--and stop talking past it. If there is the linguistic connection that I think there is, wouldn't this be obvious to the person who gave ιδου ανθρωπος ω ονομα ανατολη, as a Greek translation of the Hebrew phrase in 6:12a?

Your task was clear enough. Having done none of the above you left me wondering wtf you were doing. (And I'm still not interested in you injecting Carrier into the above.)