Freethought & Rationalism Archive

richard2 · 03-18-2004, 06:38 PM

Ciao,

I have a question about 1 Timothy 6:15-16 and immortality. The verse says, "...which God will bring about in his own time--God, the blessed and only Ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light, whom no one has seen or can see. To him be honor and might forever. Amen."

This verse says that God alone is immortal. But how can this be? For instance, angels are spiritual beings created by God. They are immortal. Also, men are a body and soul composite created by God. Their souls are immortal. At least this is how it is according to Catholic theology and orthodox Christianity.

I await your answers.

Richard

redzrx · 03-18-2004, 10:35 PM

Is what a devout would say. Have faith and forget logic and reason.. There that fixes all the problems you athiests have .. Now convert!

But seriously I think this is almost like a prayer/sales pitch and is basically meant to show that god is Immortal more so then anything else./ HE's higher,stronger,smarter,brighter.. etc.

I don't think the scribe was trying to create a conflict but to show the status of God is higher then everthing else.(either that or the translation is wrong)

Hope this makes sense.

Mario

richard2 · 03-19-2004, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by redzrx
But seriously I think this is almost like a prayer/sales pitch and is basically meant to show that god is Immortal more so then anything else./ HE's higher,stronger,smarter,brighter.. etc.
Mario

How can one being's immortality be greater than another's? But I think the verse is clear when it says "...who alone is immortal...", and not "who is most immortal". Other translations say "...who alone cannot die...", "who alone possesses immortality", etc.

Peter Kirby · 03-19-2004, 02:14 AM

It may be saying that God is the only "king" that holds power over death. "Since the emperor was viewed as immortal after death, this statement is aimed against emperor worship." (William Mounce, Pastoral Epistles, p. 362.

best,
Peter Kirby

richard2 · 03-19-2004, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Peter Kirby
It may be saying that God is the only "king" that holds power over death. "Since the emperor was viewed as immortal after death, this statement is aimed against emperor worship." (William Mounce, Pastoral Epistles, p. 362.

best,
Peter Kirby

Thanks, Peter.

Richard

redzrx · 03-19-2004, 05:26 AM

Never thought of that but .. very logical..

thanx Peter

Mario

MysteryProf · 03-21-2004, 01:26 PM

What about the "whom no one has seen or can see" part of the verse? If I recall correctly, one of the beatitudes is:

Blessed are the clean of heart: for they shall see God.

~MysteryProf

03-18-2004, 06:38 PM	#1
richard2 Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: The Nox Planet Posts: 438	1 Timothy 6:15-16 -- Immortality Ciao, I have a question about 1 Timothy 6:15-16 and immortality. The verse says, "...which God will bring about in his own time--God, the blessed and only Ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light, whom no one has seen or can see. To him be honor and might forever. Amen." This verse says that God alone is immortal. But how can this be? For instance, angels are spiritual beings created by God. They are immortal. Also, men are a body and soul composite created by God. Their souls are immortal. At least this is how it is according to Catholic theology and orthodox Christianity. I await your answers. Richard

03-18-2004, 10:35 PM	#2
redzrx Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ontario Posts: 87	don't nit pick Is what a devout would say. Have faith and forget logic and reason.. There that fixes all the problems you athiests have .. Now convert! But seriously I think this is almost like a prayer/sales pitch and is basically meant to show that god is Immortal more so then anything else./ HE's higher,stronger,smarter,brighter.. etc. I don't think the scribe was trying to create a conflict but to show the status of God is higher then everthing else.(either that or the translation is wrong) Hope this makes sense. Mario

03-19-2004, 05:26 AM	#6
redzrx Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ontario Posts: 87	thanks pete Never thought of that but .. very logical.. thanx Peter Mario

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03-19-2004, 02:14 AM	#4
Peter Kirby Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: the reliquary of Ockham's razor Posts: 4,035	It may be saying that God is the only "king" that holds power over death. "Since the emperor was viewed as immortal after death, this statement is aimed against emperor worship." (William Mounce, Pastoral Epistles, p. 362. best, Peter Kirby

03-21-2004, 01:26 PM	#7
MysteryProf Regular Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 301	What about the "whom no one has seen or can see" part of the verse? If I recall correctly, one of the beatitudes is: Blessed are the clean of heart: for they shall see God. ~MysteryProf

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