Freethought & Rationalism Archive

show_no_mercy · 05-21-2005, 12:50 PM

How did they determine which books of the Bible got put in and which were heretical? Do Christians say there was a "divine inspiriation"? If not then I'd say the current Bible was put together as a result of a power struggle between the myriad of Christian sects that existed at that time and therefore it's "truth value" (as far as a "real" Christianity is concerned) is highly doubtful.

Can someone clarify?

Toto · 05-21-2005, 01:03 PM

Formation of the New Testament Canon

Christians claim divine inspiration, but what evidence is there of that?

Amaleq13 · 05-21-2005, 01:07 PM

I suggest you start with Richard Carrier's essay: The Formation of the New Testament Canon.

Toto · 05-21-2005, 01:12 PM

great minds think alike

fta · 05-21-2005, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by show_no_mercy

How did [the Council of Nicaea] determine which books of the Bible got put in and which were heretical?

Actually, according to this article "the question of authentic and spurious gospels was not discussed at the first Nicene Council":

http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/nicaea.html

show_no_mercy · 05-21-2005, 02:34 PM

great information guys

Amaleq13 · 05-21-2005, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

great minds think alike

I bow to the superior reaction speed of the Master Linker. :notworthy

gregor2 · 05-21-2005, 05:43 PM

For what happened at the council, read "When Jesus Became God" by Rubenstein (if memory serves).

Toto · 05-21-2005, 06:02 PM

When Jesus Became God can be searched on Amazon.

Publishers Weekly makes a point of telling us

Quote:

Rubenstein, a Jew who proclaimed in a now famous book (After Auschwitz, Johns Hopkins University Press, 1992) that God died "after Auschwitz," examines the details of the fractious period in early Christian history when Christianity was defining itself against other religious sects through a number of councils and creeds.

Steven Avery · 05-22-2005, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregor2

For what happened at the council, read "When Jesus Became God" by Rubenstein (if memory serves).

My understanding is that while Rubenstein does a decent job on Nicaea, he really knows and understands very little about NT and church history from 30 A.D. to Nicaea.

"God Crucified" by Richard Bauckham would probably be the main counterpoint book. And this paper covers some of the ground.
http://www.sbl-site2.org/Congresses/...d_Bauckham.pdf
Paul's Christology of Divine Identity - Richard Bauckham
1. Early Jewish Monotheism and Early Christology

There are also some interesting early church history books by William Chalfant and Marvin Arnold and others. For discussing how the Trinity doctrine became ascendant Mark Mattison has a book that is quite interesting, perhaps the Anthony Buzzard book as well, and a David Bernard book. All of these authors are dealing with A.D. 30 ---> Nicaea .

On Nicaea and canon, along with the very excellent Roger Pearse article disassembling various myths, probably the best source of straight factual information is www.ntcanon.org including the chart of the canon references. Small caveat, sometimes when you look at the material in depth you hit certain nuances, so the chart is meant as a help, not the complete story.

Shalom,
Praxeus
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic/

05-21-2005, 12:50 PM	#1
show_no_mercy Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Dancing Posts: 9,940	The First Council Of Nicaea How did they determine which books of the Bible got put in and which were heretical? Do Christians say there was a "divine inspiriation"? If not then I'd say the current Bible was put together as a result of a power struggle between the myriad of Christian sects that existed at that time and therefore it's "truth value" (as far as a "real" Christianity is concerned) is highly doubtful. Can someone clarify?

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05-21-2005, 01:03 PM	#2
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Formation of the New Testament Canon Christians claim divine inspiration, but what evidence is there of that?

05-21-2005, 01:07 PM	#3
Amaleq13 Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Eagle River, Alaska Posts: 7,816	I suggest you start with Richard Carrier's essay: The Formation of the New Testament Canon.

05-21-2005, 01:12 PM	#4
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	great minds think alike

05-21-2005, 02:34 PM	#6
show_no_mercy Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Dancing Posts: 9,940	great information guys

05-21-2005, 05:43 PM	#8
gregor2 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: texas Posts: 86	For what happened at the council, read "When Jesus Became God" by Rubenstein (if memory serves).

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