Rick Sumner

Man, that's the second time in two weeks I missed a chance to become a prophet.

Regards,
Rick Sumner

offa

In regards, you probably may have expected offa to bring up Thiering. Myself, offa, I read Josephus often. I believe that the gospels were written before 70 AD. I believe that Jesus really existed, like a Ghandhi or a Bin Laden. I may not enjoy what I believe, but, alas, here it is. I can not find anybody else favorable to what I believe, other than Thiering (as a quotable source). Without people like myself, there would be no argument otherwise.

regards,

offa

Steven Carr

Is Jesus suggesting that the Son of God had little better to do with his precious 3 years of preaching the news that would save humanity, than to indulge in a few riddles which nobody understood?

Why not just tell the disciples how to cure cancer?

Vorkosigan

You're sparking some interesting thoughts here. Funny you mention Plato, probably facetiously.....I just finished going over Mark 10, where Jesus meets Bartimaeus, the son of Timaeus, a typical Markan double construction, since Bar Timaeus means 'son of Timaeus.' As we all know, Plato's Timaeus, the dialogue, opens with Socrates, who will be executed by the authorities like Junior, sitting with his three friends, Critias, Timaeus, and Hermocrates. The scene is parallel to Jesus, who will be executed, sitting with James, John, and Peter....Timaeus is a dialog that lays out Plato's scientific cosmology,

"When the father creator saw the creature which he had made moving and living, the created image of the eternal gods, he rejoiced..."(Jowett translation)

Anyway....your proposal that the seven= seven nations named in Deuteronomy might be right on target. It's not that important, but I wanted to know what proposals were out there...

Vorkosigan

Vorkosigan

Thanks, Toto. This is great information.

Peter Kirby

"Now the disciples had forgotten to bring any bread; and they had only one loaf with them in the boat. And he cautioned them, saying, “Watch out: beware of the yeast of the Pharisees and the yeast of Herod.� They said to one another, “It is because we have no bread.� And becoming aware of it, Jesus said to them, “Why are you talking about having no bread? Do you still not perceive or understand? Are your hearts hardened? Do you have eyes, and fail to see? Do you have ears, and fail to hear? And do you not remember? When I broke the five loaves for the five thousand, how many baskets full of broken pieces did you collect?� They said to him, “Twelve.� “And the seven for the four thousand, how many baskets full of broken pieces did you collect?� And they said to him, “Seven.� Then he said to them, “Do you not yet understand?�" (Mark 8:14-21 NRSV)

As Jan Sammer mentions, KOFINOS is used in verse 19 (of the 5000), and SPURIS is used of verse 20 (of the 4000), where each has been translated "basket." KOFINOS, for example, is used of a basket that foot soldiers carried with the rest of their gear (Wars 3.95). SPURIS is used in Acts 9:25 and Philo Spec. Leg. 3.160. This may or may not be significant.

With a few assumptions, though, we can do some fun stuff (though I have little hope that Mark did the same math). Let them be:

1. Jesus used the same multiplier on the loaves each time.
2. The same number of loaf-units were in each of the baskets after a miracle (but this number would then be different between the two miracles).
3. People ate, but the amount that would be left over wasn't changed by how many people or how much they ate. (It might be interesting to see what would change if this axiom were removed.)

For the first miracle (of the 5000), we have this formula:
Five loaves were multiplied to fill twelve KOFINOU.
5 * x = (12 * y)

For the second miracle (of the 4000), we have this formula:
Seven loaves were multiplied to fill seven SPURIS.
7 * x = (7 * z)

Let us assume that all numbers are whole and solve for the lowest possible integers (as they are the numbers with symbolical meaning).

The lowest numbers that can solve the first equation are x=12 and y=5. It then follows that, as x=z, z=12. So we have:

The multiplication factor of Jesus upon the bread is 12.
The 12 KOFINOS-baskets hold 5 each (60 total).
The 7 SPURIS-baskets hold 12 each (84 total).

Altogether there are 144 loaves of bread leftover, though we started with 12 loaves (5 + 7).

Even if it were possible that something like this were in the author's mind, what could it possibly mean? Indeed, what could it mean even if the above is impossible?

An interpretation can start with the statement that is too easily skipped over, "Watch out: beware of the yeast of the Pharisees and the yeast of Herod." Yeast, obviously, is that which makes bread rise, or grow. If one does not use the yeast of the Pharisees, nor the yeast of Herod, which does one use? That of the kingdom of God. Jesus compares the kingdom of God to a mustard seed in Mark 4:30-34, which grows from a small seed to a large plant encompassing all. This is a parable which Jesus supposedly explained to his disciples in private. Yet they still lack understanding later on, in the present passage.

If the multiplication is twelve-fold, this is understood easily enough as an allusion to the twelve apostles. Starting with 12, the apostles harvest 144. Jesus himself chose 12 apostles. The meaning is that the apostles can do what Jesus has done: gather around twelve persons to whom the gospel is imparted. They should not think of themselves as having one loaf of bread, the body of Christ, that will soon slip away. The bread of which Jesus speaks does not dwindle in supply as it is imbibed, but indeed the opposite: it is multiplied and can be shared without end.

Or, along a different tack: the numbers are used after the manner of a Zen koan, a paradox that makes one understand the illusory nature of reality. In the first case, less bread is broken (5), for more people (5000), yet more pieces are left over (x12). In the second case, more bread is broken (7), for less people (4000), yet less pieces are left over (x7). The conclusion? It is easy and of no concern to make bread and to take away bread in this world, that is of this world. That is why it should not concern his disciples; they shouldn't even take it with them on a journey (Mark 6:8). Rather, they are to carry the word of the gospel with them, the bread that is nourishment to those in the church-boat.

best,
Peter Kirby

Gawen

Loaves and baskets are euphemisms for playing the Roman scratch-off lotteries, which were illegal for Jews to participate in. "Five loaves" are five scratch-offs he played for five thousand shekels, but won only twelve, which he redeemed by bribing a Roman for half of his winnings. By the goodness of his heart he used the remaining winnings to feed the multitude and to buy seven more scratch-offs, which he won seven shekels out of 4000.


21: And he said to them, "Do you not yet
understand?" means "The fucking lotto is fixed"..but this was left out of the gospels for some reason.

Chili

You don't need the specific gravity to solve this one. The bread we receive is the indoctrinated articles of faith that must remain unchanged within our minds and never rise in us towards righteousness and understanding or we will be subject to yeast of the Pharisees who were the rulers the faith and Herod was the head of the Jewish tradition.

Joseph went to Beth-le-hem to give an account of himself and Bethehem means something like house of bread which makes Christ the bread of life and here Jesus nee Joseph was just distributing this bread of life in his own mind towards understanding. Knowledge frees and hence the harvest of breadcumbs that once upon a time had been indoctrinated and now did find understanding in truth.

Peter Kirby

There are a couple of scriptural texts that are obviously relevant.

"A man came from Baal-shalishah, bringing food from the first fruits to the man of God: twenty loaves of barley and fresh ears of grain in his sack. Elisha said, “Give it to the people and let them eat.� But his servant said, “How can I set this before a hundred people?� So he repeated, “Give it to the people and let them eat, for thus says the Lord, ‘They shall eat and have some left.’ �" (2 Kings 4:42-43 NRSV)

Exodus 16 (NRSV)
Bread from Heaven
16 The whole congregation of the Israelites set out from Elim; and Israel came to the wilderness of Sin, which is between Elim and Sinai, on the fifteenth day of the second month after they had departed from the land of Egypt. 2 The whole congregation of the Israelites complained against Moses and Aaron in the wilderness. 3 The Israelites said to them, “If only we had died by the hand of the Lord in the land of Egypt, when we sat by the fleshpots and ate our fill of bread; for you have brought us out into this wilderness to kill this whole assembly with hunger.�
4 Then the Lord said to Moses, “I am going to rain bread from heaven for you, and each day the people shall go out and gather enough for that day. In that way I will test them, whether they will follow my instruction or not. 5 On the sixth day, when they prepare what they bring in, it will be twice as much as they gather on other days.� 6 So Moses and Aaron said to all the Israelites, “In the evening you shall know that it was the Lord who brought you out of the land of Egypt, 7 and in the morning you shall see the glory of the Lord, because he has heard your complaining against the Lord. For what are we, that you complain against us?� 8 And Moses said, “When the Lord gives you meat to eat in the evening and your fill of bread in the morning, because the Lord has heard the complaining that you utter against him—what are we? Your complaining is not against us but against the Lord.�
9 Then Moses said to Aaron, “Say to the whole congregation of the Israelites, ‘Draw near to the Lord, for he has heard your complaining.’ � 10 And as Aaron spoke to the whole congregation of the Israelites, they looked toward the wilderness, and the glory of the Lord appeared in the cloud. 11 The Lord spoke to Moses and said, 12 “I have heard the complaining of the Israelites; say to them, ‘At twilight you shall eat meat, and in the morning you shall have your fill of bread; then you shall know that I am the Lord your God.’ �
13 In the evening quails came up and covered the camp; and in the morning there was a layer of dew around the camp. 14 When the layer of dew lifted, there on the surface of the wilderness was a fine flaky substance, as fine as frost on the ground. 15 When the Israelites saw it, they said to one another, “What is it?�a For they did not know what it was. Moses said to them, “It is the bread that the Lord has given you to eat. 16 This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Gather as much of it as each of you needs, an omer to a person according to the number of persons, all providing for those in their own tents.’ � 17 The Israelites did so, some gathering more, some less. 18 But when they measured it with an omer, those who gathered much had nothing over, and those who gathered little had no shortage; they gathered as much as each of them needed. 19 And Moses said to them, “Let no one leave any of it over until morning.� 20 But they did not listen to Moses; some left part of it until morning, and it bred worms and became foul. And Moses was angry with them. 21 Morning by morning they gathered it, as much as each needed; but when the sun grew hot, it melted.
22 On the sixth day they gathered twice as much food, two omers apiece. When all the leaders of the congregation came and told Moses, 23 he said to them, “This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Tomorrow is a day of solemn rest, a holy sabbath to the Lord; bake what you want to bake and boil what you want to boil, and all that is left over put aside to be kept until morning.’ � 24 So they put it aside until morning, as Moses commanded them; and it did not become foul, and there were no worms in it. 25 Moses said, “Eat it today, for today is a sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field. 26 Six days you shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is a sabbath, there will be none.�
27 On the seventh day some of the people went out to gather, and they found none. 28 The Lord said to Moses, “How long will you refuse to keep my commandments and instructions? 29 See! The Lord has given you the sabbath, therefore on the sixth day he gives you food for two days; each of you stay where you are; do not leave your place on the seventh day.� 30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
31 The house of Israel called it manna; it was like coriander seed, white, and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey. 32 Moses said, “This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Let an omer of it be kept throughout your generations, in order that they may see the food with which I fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you out of the land of Egypt.’ � 33 And Moses said to Aaron, “Take a jar, and put an omer of manna in it, and place it before the Lord, to be kept throughout your generations.� 34 As the Lord commanded Moses, so Aaron placed it before the covenant,b for safekeeping. 35 The Israelites ate manna forty years, until they came to a habitable land; they ate manna, until they came to the border of the land of Canaan. 36 An omer is a tenth of an ephah.

best,
Peter Kirby

Peter Kirby

Origen has his say in his Commentary on Matthew.



http://ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-10/anf10-47.htm

1. Introduction to the Feeding of the Five Thousand.

"And when even was come His disciples came to Him, "1 that is, at the consummation of the age in regard to which we may fitly say what is found in the Epistle of John, "It is the last hour."2 They, not yet understanding what the Word was about to do, say to Him, "The place is desert,"3 seeing the desert condition of the masses in respect of God and the Law and the Word; but they say to Him, "The time is past,"4 as if the fitting season of the law and prophets had passed. Perhaps they spoke this saying, in reference to the word of Jesus, that because of the beheading of John both the law and the prophets who were until John had ceased.5 "The time is past," therefore they say, and no food is at hand, because the season of it is no longer present, that those who have followed Thee in the desert may serve the law and the prophets. And, further, the disciples say, "Send them away,"6 that each one may buy food, if he cannot from the cities, at least from the villages,-places more ignoble. Such things the disciples said, because, after the letter of the law had been abrogated and prophecies had ceased, they despaired of unexpected and new food being found for the multitudes. But see what Jesus answers to the disciples though He does not cry out and plainly say it: "You suppose that, if the great multitude go away from Me in need of food, they will find it in villages rather than with Me, and among bodies of men, not of citizens but of villagers, rather than by abiding with Me. But I declare unto you, that in regard to that of which you suppose they are in need they are not in need, for they have no need to go away; but in regard to that of which you think they have no need-that is, of Me-as if I could not feed them, of this contrary to your expectation they have need. Since, then, I have trained you, and made you fit to give rational food to them who are in need of it, give ye to the crowds who have followed Me to eat; for ye have the power, which ye have received from Me, of giving the multitudes to eat; and if ye had attended to this, ye would have understood that I am far more able to feed them, and ye would not have said, 'Send the multitudes away that they may go and buy food for themselves.'"7

2. Exposition of the Details of the Miracle.

Jesus, then, because of the power which He gave to the disciples, even the power of nourishing others, said, Give ye them to eat.8 But (not denying that they can give loaves, but thinking that there were much too few and not sufficient to feed those who followed Jesus, and not considering that when Jesus takes each loaf-the Word-He extends it as far as He wills, and makes it suffice for all whomsoever He desires to nourish), the disciples say, We have here but five loaves and two fishes.9 Perhaps by the five loaves they meant to make a veiled reference to the sensible words of the Scriptures, corresponding in number on this account to the five senses, but by the two fishes either to the word expressed10 and the word conceived,11 which are a relish, so to speak, to the sensible things contained in the Scriptures; or, perhaps, to the word which had come to them about the Father and the Son. Wherefore also after His resurrection He ate of a broiled fish,12 having taken a part from the disciples, and having received that theology about the Father which they were in part able to declare to Him. Such is the contribution we have been able to give to the exposition of the word about the five loaves and the two fishes; and probably those, who are better able than we to gather together the five loaves and the two fishes among themselves, would be able to give a fuller and better interpretation of their meaning. It must be observed, however, that while in Matthew, Mark, and Luke,13 the disciples say that they have the five loaves and the two fishes, without indicating whether they were wheaten or of barley, John alone says, that the loaves were barley loaves.14 Wherefore, perhaps, in the Gospel of John the disciples do not acknowledge that the loaves are with them, but say in John, "There is a lad here who has five barley loaves and two fishes."15 And so long as these five loaves and two fishes were not carried by the disciples of Jesus, they did not increase or multiply, nor were they able to nourish more; but, when the Saviour took them, and in the first placed looked up to heaven, with the rays of His eyes, as it were, drawing down from it power which was to be mingled with the loaves and the fishes which were about to feed the five thousand; and after this blessed the five loaves and the two fishes, increasing and multiplying them by the word and the blessing; and in the third place dividing and breaking He gave to the disciples that they might set them before the multitudes, then the loaves and the fishes were sufficient, so that all ate and were satisfied, and some portions of the loaves which had been blessed they were unable to eat. For so much remained over to the multitudes, which was not according to the capacity of the multitudes but of the disciples who were able to take up that which remained over of the broken pieces, and to place it in baskets filled with that which remained over, which were in number so many as the tribes of Israel. Concerning Joseph, then, it is written in the Psalms, "His hands served in the basket,"16 but about the disciples of Jesus that they took up that which remained over of the broken pieces twelve baskets, twelve baskets, I take it, not half-full but filled. And there are, I think, up to the present time, and will be until the consummation of the age with the disciples of Jesus, who are superior to the multitudes, the twelve baskets, filled with the broken pieces of living bread which the multitudes cannot eat. Now those who ate of the five loaves which existed before the twelve baskets that remained over, were kindred in nature to the number five; for those who ate had reached the stage of sensible things, since also they were nourished by Him who looked up to heaven and blessed and brake them, and were not boys nor women, but men. For there are, I think, even in sensible foods differences, so that some of them belong to those who "have put away childish things,"17 and some to those who are still babes and carnal in Christ.

3. The Exposition of Details Continued. The Sitting Down on the Grass. The Division into Companies.

We have spoken these things because of the words, "They that did eat were five thousand men, beside children and women, "18 which is an ambiguous expression; for either those who ate were five thousand men, and among those who ate there was no child or woman; or the men only were five thousand, the children and the women not being reckoned. Some, then, as we have said by anticipation, have so understood the passage that neither children nor women were present, when the increase and multiplication of the five loaves and the two fishes took place. Bat some one might say that, while many ate and according to their desert and capacity participated in the loaves of blessing, some worthy to be numbered, corresponding to the men of twenty years old who are numbered in the Book of Numbers,19 were Israelitish men, but others who were not worthy of such account and numbering were children and women. Moreover, interpret with me allegorically the children in accordance with the passage, "I could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, as unto babes in Christ; "20 and the women in accordance with the saying, "I wish to present you all as a pure virgin to Christ; "21 and the men according to the saying, "When I am become a man I have put away childish things."22 Let us not pass by without exposition the words, "He commanded the multitudes to sit down on the grass, and He look the five loaves and the two fishes, and looking up to heaven, He blessed, and brake, and gave the loaves to the disciples, and the disciples to the multitudes. And they did all eat."23 For what is meant by the words, "And He commanded all the multitudes to sit down on the grass? "And what are we to understand in the passage worthy of the command of Jesus? Now, I think that He commanded the multitudes to sit down on the grass because of what is said in Isaiah, "All flesh is grass; "24 that is to say, He commanded them to put the flesh under, and to keep in subjection "the mind of the flesh,"25 that so any one might be able to partake of the loaves which Jesus blesses. Then since there are different orders of those who need the food which Jesus supplies and all are not nourished by equal words, on this account I think that Mark has written, "And He commanded them that they should all sit down by companies upon the green grass; and they sat down in ranks by hundreds and by fifties; "26 but Luke, "And He said unto His disciples, Make them sit down in companies about fifty each."27 For it was necessary that those who were to find rest in the food of Jesus should either be in the order of the hundred-the sacred number-which is consecrated to God, because of the unit, (in it) or in the order of the fifty-the number which embraces the remission of sins, in accordance with the mystery of the Jubilee which took place every fifty years, and of the feast at Pentecost. And I think that the twelve baskets were in the possession of the disciples to whom it was said "Ye shall sit upon twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel."28 And as the throne of him who judges the tribe of Reuben might be said to be a mystery, and the throne of him who judges the tribe of Simeon, and another of him who judges the tribe of Judah, and so on with the others; so there might be a basket of the food of Reuben, and another of Simeon, and another of Levi. But it is not in accordance with our present discourse now to digress so far from the subject in hand as to collect what is said about the twelve tribes, and separately what is said about each of them, and to say what each tribe of Israel may signify.





19. Concerning the Seven Loaves. The Narrative of the Feeding of the Four Thousand Compared with that of the Five Thousand.

"And Jesus called unto Him His disciples and said."199 Above in the similar history to this about the loaves, before the loaves are spoken of, "Jesus came forth and saw a great multitude and had compassion upon them and healed their sick. And when even was come the disciples came to Him saying, The place is desert and the time is already past, send them away,"200 etc. But now after the healing of the deaf and the rest, He takes compassion on the multitude which had continued with Him now three days and had nothing to eat. And there the disciples make request concerning the five thousand;201 but here He speaks of His own accord about the four thousand.202 Those, too, are fed when it was evening after they had spent a day with Him; but these, who are testified to have continued with Him three days, partake of the loaves lest they might faint by the way. And there the disciples say to Him when He was not inquiring, that they had only five loaves and two fishes; but here to Him making inquiry, they give answer about the seven loaves and the few small fishes. And there He commands the multitudes to sit down or lie upon the grass; for Luke also wrote, "Make them sit down,"203 and Mark says, "He commanded them all to sit down; "204 but here He does not command but proclaims205 to the multitude to sit down. Again, there, the three Evangelists say in the very same words that "He took the five loaves and the two fishes and looking up to heaven He blessed; "206 but here, as Matthew and Mark have written, "Jesus gave thanks and brake; "207 there, they recline upon the grass, but here they sit down upon the ground. You will moreover investigate in the accounts in the different places the variation found in John, who wrote in regard to that transaction that Jesus said, "Make the men sit down,"208 and that, having given thanks, He gave of the loaves to them that were set down, but he did not mention this miracle at all.209 Attending, then, to the difference of those things which are written in the various places in regard to the loaves, I think that these belong to a different order from those; wherefore these are fed in a mountain, and those in a desert place; and these after they had continued three days with Jesus, but those one day, on the evening of which they were fed. And further, unless it be the same thing for Jesus to do a thing of Himself and to act after having heard from the disciples, consider if those to whom Jesus shows kindness are not superior when He fed them on the spot with a view to showing them kindness. And, if according to John,210 they were barley loaves of which the twelve baskets remained over, but nothing of this kind is said about these, how are not these superior to the former? And the sick of those He healed,211 but here He heals these, along with the multitudes, who were not sick but blind, and lame, and deaf, and maimed; wherefore also in regard to these the four thousand marvel,212 but in regard to the sick no such thing is said. And these I think who ate of the seven loaves for which thanks were given, are superior to those who ate of the five which were blessed; and these who ate the few little fishes to those who ate of the two, and perhaps also these who sat down upon the ground to those who sat down on the grass. And those from fewer loaves leave twelve baskets, but these from a greater number leave seven baskets, inasmuch, as they were able to receive more. And perhaps these tread upon all earthly things and sit down upon them, but those upon the grass-upon their flesh only-for "all flesh is grass."213 Consider also after this, that Jesus does not wish to send them away fasting lest they faint on the way, as being without the loaves of Jesus, and while they were still on the way-the way to their own concerns-might suffer injury. Take note also of the cases where Jesus is recorded to have sent any one away, that you may see the difference of those who were sent away by Him after being fed, and those who had been sent away otherwise; and, as a pattern of one who was sent away otherwise, take "Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity."214 But further the disciples who are always with Jesus are not sent away by Him; but the multitudes after they have eaten are sent away. Likewise, again, the disciples who conceive nothing great about the Canaanitish woman say, "Send her away, for she crieth after us; "215 but the Saviour does not at all appear to send her away; for saying unto her, "O woman, great is thy faith, be it done to thee even as thou wilt,"216 He healed her daughter from that hour: it is not however written that He sent her away. So far at the present time have we been able to investigate and see into the passage before us.






http://ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-10/anf10-48.htm

5. Concerning the Leaven of the Pharisees.

"And His disciples came to the other side and forgot to take loaves."33 Since the loaves which they had before they came to the other side were no longer useful to the disciples when they came to the other side, for they needed one kind of loaves before they crossed and a different kind when they crossed,-on this account, being careless of taking loaves when going to the other side, they forgot to take loaves with them. To the other side then came the disciples of Jesus who had passed over from things material to things spiritual, and from things sensible to those which are intellectual. And perhaps that He might turn back those who, by crossing to the other side, "had begun in spirit,"34 from running back to carnal things, Jesus said to them when on the other side, "Take heed and beware."35 For there was a certain lump of teaching and of truly ancient leaven,-that according to the bare letter, and on this account not freed from those things which arise from wickedness,-which the Pharisees and Sadducees offered, of which Jesus does not wish His own disciples any longer to eat, having made for them a new and spiritual lump, offering Himself to those who gave up the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees and had come to Him-"the living bread which came down from heaven and gives life to the world."36 But since, to him who is no longer going to use the leaven and the lump and the teaching of the Pharisees and the Sadducees, the first thing is to "see" and then to "beware," so that no one, by reason of not seeing and from want of taking heed, may ever partake of their forbidden leaven,-on this account He says to the disciples, first, "see," and then, "beware." It is the mark of the clear-sighted and careful to separate the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees and every food that is not of "the unleavened-bread of sincerity and truth"37 from the living bread, even that which came down from heaven, so that no one who eats may adopt the things of the Pharisees and the Sadducees, but by eating the living and true bread may strengthen his soul. And we might seasonably apply the saying to those who, along with the Christian way of life, prefer to live as the Jews, materially, for these do not see nor beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees, but, contrary to the will of Jesus who forbade it, eat the bread of the Pharisees. Yea and also all, who do not wish to understand that the law is spiritual, and has a shadow of the good things to come,38 and is a shadow of the things to come,39 neither inquire of what good thing about to be each of the laws is a shadow, nor do they see nor beware of the leaven of the Pharisees; and they also who reject the doctrine of the resurrection of the dead are not on their guard against the leaven of the Sadducees. And there are many among the heterodox who, because of their unbelief in regard to the resurrection of the dead, are imbued with the leaven of the Sadducees. Now, while Jesus said these things, the disciples reasoned, saying not aloud, but in their own hearts, "We took no loaves."40 And something like this was what they said, "If we had loaves we would not have had to take of the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees; but since, from want of loaves, we run the risk of taking from their leaven, while the Saviour does not wish us to run back to their teaching, therefore He said to us, "Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees."41 And these things then they reasoned; Jesus, while looking to that which was in their hearts, and hearing the reasons in them, as the true overseer of hearts, reproves them because they did not see nor remember the loaves which they received from Him; on account of which, even when they appeared to be in want of loaves, they did not need the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees.

6. The Meaning of Leaven. Jesus' Knowledge of the Heart.

Then expounding clearly and representing to them, who were being distracted because of the equivocal meaning of loaf and leaven, in an undisguised fashion, that He was not speaking to them about sensible bread but about the leaven in the teaching, He subjoins, "How is it that ye do not perceive that I spake not you concerning bread? But beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees."42 And though He had not laid bare the interpretation, but still continued to use metaphorical language, the disciples would have understood that the discourse of the Saviour was about the teaching, figuratively called leaven, which the Pharisees and Sadducees were teaching. So long, then, as we have Jesus with us fulfilling the promise which runs, "Lo, I am with you always unto the consummation of the age,"43 we cannot fast nor be in want of food, so that, because of want of it we should desire to take and eat the forbidden leaven, even from the Pharisees and Sadducees. Now there may sometimes be a time, when He is with us, that we are without food, as is spoken of in the passage above, "They continue with me now three days and have nothing to eat; "44 but, even though this should happen, being unwilling to send us away fasting lest we faint on the way, He gives thanks over the loaves which were with the disciples, and causes us to have the seven baskets over from the seven loaves, as we have recorded. And moreover this also is to be observed, in view of those who think that the divinity of the Saviour is not at all demonstrable from the Gospel of Matthew, that the fact that, when the disciples were reasoning among themselves and saying, "We have no loaves," Jesus knew their reasonings and said, "Why reason ye among yourselves, O ye of little faith, because ye took no loaves,"45 was beyond the power of man; for the Lord alone, as Solomon says in the third Book of Kings, knows the hearts of men.46 But since the disciples understood, when Jesus said, "Beware of the leaven,"47 that He did not tell them to beware of the loaves but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees, you will understand that whenever leaven is named it is put figuratively for teaching, whether in the law, or in the Scriptures which come after the law; and so perhaps leaven is not offered upon the altar; for it is not right that prayers should take the form of teaching, but should only be supplications of good things from God. But one might inquire, on account of what has been said about disciples who came to the other side, if any one who has reached the other side can be reproached as one of little faith, and as not yet understanding nor remembering what was done by Jesus. But it is not difficult, I think, to say to this, that in relation to that which is perfect, on the coming of which "that which is in part shall be done away,"48 all our faith here is little faith, and in regard to that, we who know in part do not yet know nor remember; for we are not able to obtain a memory which is sufficient and able to attain to the magnitude of the nature of the speculations.


best,
Peter Kirby