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Old 12-19-2012, 10:08 PM   #1
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Default Nazareth first century.

Assuming Nazareth existed just to stop those arguements now.

Im toying with the idea it was a first century Jewish work camp for the building of Sepphoris.

With the church said to have been built over much of the first century ruins, this leaves no evidence one way or the other.



Even if it was not used for labor building the city, the population of Sepphoris demanded quite a bit of agriculture just to sustain itself.

This burden would have been placed on local Jewish labor forces in all nearby villages.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:16 PM   #2
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Why "Jewish?" (And here I am going along along with your stated condition.)

Sepphoris was a Greco-Roman town with pagan temples. When the Great Revolt broke out they shut their gates to Josephus and his rebels and admitted a Roman garrison.

History tells us that Galilee was forcibly converted to Judaism only at the very end of the 2d century BC by Alexander Jannai. Why would we assume that there was any great devotion to "Judaism" in the region...especially as the Romans came rolling through in 64 BC and basically liberated the place from the Hasmoneans?
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Old 12-20-2012, 07:53 PM   #3
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Why "Jewish?" (And here I am going along along with your stated condition.)

Sepphoris was a Greco-Roman town with pagan temples. When the Great Revolt broke out they shut their gates to Josephus and his rebels and admitted a Roman garrison.

History tells us that Galilee was forcibly converted to Judaism only at the very end of the 2d century BC by Alexander Jannai. Why would we assume that there was any great devotion to "Judaism" in the region...especially as the Romans came rolling through in 64 BC and basically liberated the place from the Hasmoneans?
But Josephas also tells us there were 4 main groups within Judaism.

Zealots, Pharisees, Saducees, Essenes.


And I do believe the Zealots hail from Galilee.
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Old 12-21-2012, 11:18 AM   #4
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The reason that Sepphoris had to be rebuilt was that they did rebel in the aftermath of the death of Herod the Great. A Roman Army under P. Quinctillius Varus burned the city to the ground c 4 BC.

Perhaps the lesson sank in?

Now, Josephus cites the "founder" of the Zealot movement as Judas the Galilean but he also places the beginning during the riots which broke out in Judaea during the census of Quirinius ( c 6 AD ). Those riots were confined to Judaea though because Herod Antipas continued to rule Galilee and Perea. So even giving Josephus the benefit of the doubt it would seem that Judas the Galilean was not active in Galilee but in Judaea.
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Old 12-21-2012, 12:05 PM   #5
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Then why was the war in Galilee ?
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Old 12-21-2012, 01:04 PM   #6
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History tells us that Galilee was forcibly converted to Judaism only at the very end of the 2d century BC by Alexander Jannai.

Do you have any sources that Galilee did not contain Judaism prior to the first century?


As far as I know this has never been debated by anyone, nor in question.
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Old 12-22-2012, 04:14 PM   #7
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There is sufficient reason to believe that "Josephus" is full of baloney, or at least parts thereof if his writings are a cut and paste job or filled with interpolations.
Only an ignoramus would equate unknown Essenes or a group of brigands such as the "Zealots" to religious "philosophies" especially when there were many Jewish sects at the time, many probably larger than either the Essenes or the Zealots......


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minimalist View Post
Why "Jewish?" (And here I am going along along with your stated condition.)

Sepphoris was a Greco-Roman town with pagan temples. When the Great Revolt broke out they shut their gates to Josephus and his rebels and admitted a Roman garrison.

History tells us that Galilee was forcibly converted to Judaism only at the very end of the 2d century BC by Alexander Jannai. Why would we assume that there was any great devotion to "Judaism" in the region...especially as the Romans came rolling through in 64 BC and basically liberated the place from the Hasmoneans?
But Josephas also tells us there were 4 main groups within Judaism.

Zealots, Pharisees, Saducees, Essenes.


And I do believe the Zealots hail from Galilee.
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Old 12-22-2012, 04:18 PM   #8
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You mean the Itureans, not "Galilee." This is in Josephus, but is nowhere mentioned in any Talmudic or midrashic source on the period.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Minimalist View Post
Why "Jewish?" (And here I am going along along with your stated condition.)

Sepphoris was a Greco-Roman town with pagan temples. When the Great Revolt broke out they shut their gates to Josephus and his rebels and admitted a Roman garrison.

History tells us that Galilee was forcibly converted to Judaism only at the very end of the 2d century BC by Alexander Jannai. Why would we assume that there was any great devotion to "Judaism" in the region...especially as the Romans came rolling through in 64 BC and basically liberated the place from the Hasmoneans?
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Old 12-22-2012, 04:20 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Duvduv View Post
There is sufficient reason to believe that "Josephus" is full of baloney, or at least parts thereof if his writings are a cut and paste job or filled with interpolations.
Only an ignoramus would equate unknown Essenes or a group of brigands such as the "Zealots" to religious "philosophies" especially when there were many Jewish sects at the time, many probably larger than either the Essenes or the Zealots......


Quote:
Originally Posted by outhouse View Post

But Josephas also tells us there were 4 main groups within Judaism.

Zealots, Pharisees, Saducees, Essenes.


And I do believe the Zealots hail from Galilee.
What sources do you that Josephus was "full of boloney"
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Old 12-22-2012, 04:25 PM   #10
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There are no corroborating sources for his claims about Massada. The claims about Herod are not corroborated. The claim about four philosophies has no basis. And the fact that the books under his name were only found among the church weakens credibility about the books as actual writings from the end of the 1st century.
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