Jack the Bodiless

Given Turkel's alleged fear of assassination, why would he post video footage of himself?

His "enemies" would already know what he looks like, but up-to-date images would still help. And it would definitely help their hired hitmen who might not have seen him before.

John Kesler

It is the same person.

He claims that "James Patrick Holding" was his birth name, and a family tree bears out that his birth father has the last name "Holding," so I think we have good circumstantial evidence that he's telling the truth.

He made this claim at least as far back as 2003.

RED DAVE

One of the genologies is actually his mother's.

RED DAVE

MiddleMan

Ok, as far as the name goes, it may have been that he was born a Holding (whether a James Patrick or an Ishkibibble, who knows?) but maybe VERY soon after his parents divorced and his mother renamed him Robert Turkel after her own maiden name. So, when fishing for an identity to hide behind when he started Tekton, he chose the Holding name with the excuse that it is every much his real name as Robert Turkel is. He just gave a lame excuse for pulling it out of his history; as well as a lame excuse for using it still ("I'm too well known by Holding to drop it.")

Makes sense and lines up with everything else he does. A smidgen of truth coated in a lot of deception and twists and turns.

Sauron

That may be.

However, my encounter with Turkel dates from almost a decade prior to that - long before he started Tekton (in 1996). I was reviewing some of his claims in his response called "A Jury in Need of Dismissal", back when both "The Jury is In" and "Dismissal" were in bits & pieces, and not fully collected into their current forms. At that time it was known that he had changed his name. When confronted, he wasn't making any such claim about a birth name being changed. But he *was* peddling his assassination rationale for his enfant terrible nom de plume.

So yes: there may have been an original name. But the fantasy tale about the dangerous life of a prison librarian is classic over-the-top Turkel.

Amaleq13

Yes but, while that shows he didn't just pull the entire name out of thin air, it really does nothing to support his claim that his original name was James Patrick Holding (contra Kesler's comment).

Too many weak/weird excuses to be credible IMO.

John Kesler

How can you say that a genealogy, which bears out that "Holding" was his birth-father's name, does nothing to support his claim? The family tree isn't rock-solid, absolute proof that "James Patrick Holding" was his birth name, but it's a piece of evidence in his favor.

Amaleq13

Simple. His claim wasn't about his birth-father's name and the same genealogy gives his name as Robert Turkel.

Maybe his original last name was "Holding" and the change isn't reflected on the tree but "maybe" doesn't constitute support for a claim and what is given contradicts it.

diana

I've seen such discussions on this particular person several places on the net over the years, and after skimming through this closely-researched and enthusiastic one, I just have to ask: Why the hell do y'all care?

I was satisfied that he gave a silly reason in the first place for having an internet pseudonym when (in my opinion) using a moniker here is an accepted fact of life for 99.9% of the online population (well...at least until Facebook and Myspace, etc). His apparent need to explain it suggests to me that he's a flake. Beyond that, who gives a damn?

Interesting point, IMO, on how he hasn't actually published anything. I would imagine that's because when one's claims and arguments are printed on paper, one cannot simply overwrite the page and claim one never made that claim/argument. Actual publishing would cause a snag in his MO.

d

John Kesler

He has written two books.