Freethought & Rationalism Archive

deank · 08-06-2001, 12:01 PM

Well, I wanted to ask this before I left for vacation and forgot about it. Anyway, what is the context for this scripture? What didn't "they" receive and why?

Hebrews 11:37-40 (NIV)
They were stoned; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated -- the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground. These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.

Celsus · 08-06-2001, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by deank:
<STRONG>Well, I wanted to ask this before I left for vacation and forgot about it. Anyway, what is the context for this scripture? What didn't "they" receive and why?

Hebrews 11:37-40 (NIV)
They were stoned; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated -- the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground. These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.</STRONG>

The meaning is that what was promised to them (eg. Abraham and his seed bearing a nation etc.) did not occur (or could not be perceived) within their lifetime. Verse 13 is probably clearer. That makes the Bible great! Every promise from God shouldn't happen in your lifetime, so that it can build up the faith of future generations through your faith! Praise!

rodahi · 08-06-2001, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by joejoejoe:
<STRONG>

The meaning is that what was promised to them (eg. Abraham and his seed bearing a nation etc.) did not occur (or could not be perceived) within their lifetime. Verse 13 is probably clearer. That makes the Bible great! Every promise from God shouldn't happen in your lifetime, so that it can build up the faith of future generations through your faith! Praise!

</STRONG>

Why should "faith" have anything to do with it?

rodahi

Pitshade · 08-06-2001, 05:55 PM

The author is speaking of paradise.

Quote:

Heb.11:13-16
These all died in faith, not having received what was promised, but having seen it and greeted it from afar, and having acknowledged that they were strangers and exiles on the earth. For people who speak thus make it clear that they are seeking a homeland. If they had been thinking of that land from which they had gone out, they would have had opportunity to return. But as it is, they desire a better country, that is, a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared for them a city.

Ultimately the author is trying to bolster the faithful. He's telling them that if they have faith they will be rewarded by God with a better life. He then goes on in the next chapter to call on them to stop being so sinful.

According to the appendix in my RSV Bible, the letter was supposed to "show the superiority of the Christian revelation over that received through Moses. <snip> The Hebrews were advised to bear their persecutions patiently, and not grieve too much over the loss of the Temple service. Faced with trials, converts were in constant danger of relapsing into Judaism, their old faith, and of attaching too much importance to forms of worship."

[ August 06, 2001: Message edited by: Pitshade ]

Toto · 08-06-2001, 06:00 PM

I'm not sure what you're looking for here. Are you trying to make sense of Christianity? (If so, you're missing the point, IMHO). The whole passage is a paean to "faith", and runs through a list of OT personages who had faith in God, and are commended for it, but still didn't have salvation through the Son.

You might check out what Earl Doherty says about Hebrews.

08-06-2001, 12:01 PM	#1
deank Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: St. Simons Island, GA, USA Posts: 87	Context of Hebrews 11:37-40? Well, I wanted to ask this before I left for vacation and forgot about it. Anyway, what is the context for this scripture? What didn't "they" receive and why? Hebrews 11:37-40 (NIV) They were stoned; they were sawed in two; they were put to death by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated -- the world was not worthy of them. They wandered in deserts and mountains, and in caves and holes in the ground. These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.

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08-06-2001, 06:00 PM	#5
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	I'm not sure what you're looking for here. Are you trying to make sense of Christianity? (If so, you're missing the point, IMHO). The whole passage is a paean to "faith", and runs through a list of OT personages who had faith in God, and are commended for it, but still didn't have salvation through the Son. You might check out what Earl Doherty says about Hebrews.

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