Hebrews 11: 1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

So this means Faith is whatever we hope and wish for. It is also considered EVIDENCE of things which we have no proof of.

Christians are told to hope and wish in God/Jesus, all the stories of the Bible, miracles, and an afterlife. And the proof that it is real is evidenced in one's wishing and hoping it is real.

Can a Christian out there explain it any other way?

Sure they can explain it another way. It goes like this:
"You, you heathen God-hating devil-spawned infidel, can shut up right now. We know we are right and you are wrong, our faith tells us so, and thats all there is to it, NO MATTER WHAT YOU OR ANYONE ELSE SAYS. You don't like it? Then you can go straight to Hell where heathens like you belong for not Praising and Worshipping the Gawd of the Holy Bahble!"
They frequently use aproximate equivelents of this reasoning when all else fails (i.e. after about 5 minutes of conversing with a freethinker).

[This message has been edited by Cute Little Baby (edited July 04, 2001).]

TRY THIS THINKER,

faith is believing in good things to take plase in your life

fear is simply faith in reverse.
believing in bad things to take place in your life.
even athiests believe in being positive and not negative.
why, because this is a powerful force (like a ruder on a boat , it directs your life to prosperity or shipreck).

positive thinking (faith) leads to prosperity
negative thinking (fear) leads you up the garden path.

iv`e tryed both,fear suck and faith produces out of site.

Which path leads to proper spelling and punctuation?

Alan Watts once said something like belief is like holding onto a rock in the raging river; faith is learning to swim.

As Jesus seems to have understood it, faith is related more to trust--to a lack of anxiety--rather than being able to rattle off a set of beliefs or dogma.

It is interesting that for the synoptic communities, faith was necessary for miracles and healing. On the opposite side of the matter, John's gospel sees miracles (or "signs") as being needed to engender faith in Jesus' followers.



[This message has been edited by aikido7 (edited July 09, 2001).]

Truthseekar, please consult a dictionary. Your definitions are false. While it is true (SingleDad pointed this out in another thread) that the dictionary serves us, not the other way around - without semantics, there can be no communication. Your arguments will withstand far more criticism if you refrain from twisting the meanings of words to accommodate your argument.

"Faith"
Wolf's definition, a tool used as a method of control of reality challenged masses, by the elite Iconic representatives of God and/or Gods, seeking to enslave the population in a mindnumbing fear, with the aim of the establishment of severe guilt, and the destruction of self esteem for the purpose of increasing the wealth and power structure of the religious order involved.

"Faith" unseen.
"Faith" immeasurable.
"Faith" an unnatural mystic concept used by religious leaders to change absurdities into
their own form of "truth".
"Faith" a concept that subverts knowledge
and intelligence and qualitative and quantitative analysis, in favor of mythology.
When presented properly, this "faith" can be used to repress the common sense of the masses, thereby making them more subseptable to circular and illogical thinking patterns.
"Faith" = Brain mush.
Wolf

Agnostic Al

[QUOTE]Originally posted by critical thinking made ez:
[QB]Hebrews 11: 1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Faith is commonly used in the NT (after his death) to refer to Faith in Jesus as the Christ and in the message they where claiming.

To have to preach so much faith, they must not have had one piece of evidence to prove any of the claims they made.

If they couldn't prove Jesus' claim to the Godhead even at the time of his death, how much more difficult is it now?

Garotte

Main Entry: 1faith
Pronunciation: 'fAth
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural faiths /'fAths, sometimes 'fA[th]z/
Etymology: Middle English feith, from Old French feid, foi, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust -- more at BIDE
Date: 13th century
1 a : allegiance to duty or a person : LOYALTY b (1) : fidelity to one's
promises (2) : sincerity of intentions
2 a (1) : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2) : belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1) : firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2) : complete trust 3 : something that is believed especially with strong conviction;
especially : a system of religious beliefs
synonym see BELIEF
- in faith : without doubt or question : VERILY


A theist places faith in their respective system of belief, based upon the perspective of their experiences.

An atheist places faith in their respective system of belief, based upon the perspective of their experiences.

Both could be construed as faith based systems, the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things unseen. The theist the faith that there is, the atheist the faith that there is not. Both systems based upon the individual's experiences and gathered perceptions.

Be well, be wise, and search for truth.

[ July 10, 2001: Message edited by: Garotte ]

rodahi

You are incorrect here.

A theist has faith in the existence of absurdities for which there is no evidence. An atheist does not.

rodahi