xeren

Okay, i have a big assignment for an infidel, should they choose to undertake it...

I was wondering if anyone could run down the whole argument for the proof of the resurrection and why Christians believe the stories in the Bible point to us being able to know for a fact that Jesus actually was resurrected.

So far, in dealing with Christians i have only gotten bits and pieces of the issue, like "it can be proven that the tomb was empty", though i don't know why they think it can be shown that the tomb was empty. Or "paul was converted by jesus from a persecuter to a christian" but i don't know what evidence points to Christians believing that to be true or why that has anything to do with, well, anything.

Any help with a run over the main tenets of why Chrsitians believe their faith is "intellectually" based would be very helpful.

Thanks in advance
-xeren

Peter Kirby

Christians take different approaches to this, as do infidels. Many Christians do not believe that the resurrection of Jesus (or its associated stories) can be established with the methods of historical criticism. For example, Archbishop Peter Carnley of Perth, Australia in The Structure of Resurrection Belief states: "For, try as we may, and with all the positive good will in the world, we simply do not have sufficient evidence to say for certain whether the tomb is a very primitive story whose kernel is factual, or whether in fact it is a later development, the product of faith, given a particular set of theoretical presuppositions about what might necessarily be involved in resurrection belief. Given the meagreness of the evidence it is difficult to see that the logical shortfall can be overcome by purely rational argument, using only the critical techniques of scientific historiography." Carnley goes on to state that he accepts the resurrection on the testimony of the living church.

If you would like to get a detailed exposition of the conservative Christian's arguments with regard to the resurrection, I suggest that you put in a library loan request for Assessing the New Testament Evidence for the Resurrection of Jesus. I have read it, and I was not convinced, but I have not found a more extensive discussion of the matter. Craig has basically condensed the arguments there in subsequent debates and essays. Some of these essays are available here.

<a href="http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/menus/historical.html" target="_blank">http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/menus/historical.html</a>

Craig explains that his apologetic for the resurrection has three pillars here (the empty tomb, the appearances, and the origin of the resurrection idea):

<a href="http://www.leaderu.com/truth/1truth22.html" target="_blank">http://www.leaderu.com/truth/1truth22.html</a>

Craig responds to the "spiritual resurrection" hypothesis concerning Paul's belief in this essay:

<a href="http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/bodily.html" target="_blank">http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/bodily.html</a>

Craig provides detail on the empty tomb arguments here:

<a href="http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/tomb2.html" target="_blank">http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/tomb2.html</a>

I have written my own article that addresses Craig's arguments specifically concerning the alleged empty tomb.

<a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/peter_kirby/tomb/" target="_blank">http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/peter_kirby/tomb/</a>

Jeff Lowder has independently dissected Craig's case.

<a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jeff_lowder/empty.html" target="_blank">http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jeff_lowder/empty.html</a>

If you have any specific questions on the arguments concerning the resurrection pro and con, fire away. Today at lunch I was reading through an old Forum (Jesus Seminar) issue with essays from Gerd Ludemann, Stephen Patterson, and others on the matter.

I might write another article with regards to the alleged resurrection when someone subjects my existing essay to some criticism. It has been around for about two years without receiving any responses of which I know, but I don't know whether that is good or bad. Robert Price told me that my essay (not online) "The Case Against the Empty Tomb" will be published in the Journal of Higher Criticism, so perhaps that will provoke a response among the scholars that read it.

best,
Peter Kirby

Amos

The answer here is very simple xeren because resurrection happened many times since and will continue to happen in Christendom.

If we are to follow the footsteps of Jesus that would include crucifixion, resurrection, ascention, assumption and coronation.

Vorkosigan

This one is especially popular among the followers of Jesus

Amos

All right how about the Assumption and subsequent Coronation of Mary.

These two alone should be an alert to all literalists.

xeren

Thanks Kirby, I'm in the process of reading those essays.

and Amos, i STILL don't understand what the hell you are talking about. But thanks for the reply

-xeren