Freethought & Rationalism Archive

beekay · 04-03-2003, 10:37 AM

Quote:

13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six - - 666.

A story in the Newswire about highway 666 being renamed got me to wondering about this legendary number. I'm curious as to what in the hell it is supposed to mean. "Count the number of the beast" ... is 666 the number of beasts, the name of a beast ... what? "For it is the number of a man"? Does that mean 666 on a man means he is the beast?

A quick internet search turns up bunches of goofy conspiracy-type crap. I'm looking for information a bit more serious.

Toto · 04-03-2003, 10:54 AM

The Hebrews assigned a number to each letter, and the sum of the values of the letters in a name was supposed to have some mystical significance. It's a kind of numerology which was taken very seriously back then. The letters in Nero's name add up to 666.

Do a search on 'gematria' for more information.

This is from a search on the secweb:

Quote:

New Book Explores Encoded Numerological Values within the New Testament Gospels

Gleason, Daniel. (1998): The Gematria Mysteries of Jesus Christ. Available online at: http://www.jesus8880.com/homepage.htm . 400 pages (180 diagrams). $20.00.

The Greek text of three of the four gospels and the book of Revelation, Gleason argues, are filled with hidden meaning based on the lost literary art called gematria. Gematria is "mathematical divination" or the process of encoding values within words that have double meanings, an ordinary one for public consumption and a sacred one known only to cult members. In religious writings of the ancient world, only those who were initiated into the sect knew the numerological significance of the encoded words. One example Gleason provides in the book is of the Greek sun god Mithras and his Egyptian equivalent Abraxas. Each letter of Mithras (MeiqraV = 40+5+10+9+100+1+200) adds up to 365; similarly, Abraxas (AbracaV = 1+2+100+1+60+1+200) also adds up to 365, the number of days in one solar year. One famous example from the New Testament book of Revelation involves the so-called number of the beast: "Wisdom is needed here; one who understands can calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and the number of it is 666" (Rev. 13:18). Gleason reveals the identity of the "beast" in his work. Gleason also discusses at length the gematria value of Jesus (Greek = Iesous), the secret wisdom-sayings of the Gospel of Thomas, encoded values in the Synoptic gospels, and the full history behind the gematria mathematical superstition. Interested readers can find out more and download the first chapter online at http://www.jesus8880.com/homepage.htm .

mike_decock · 04-03-2003, 11:35 AM

Quote:

The Number of Its Name
Rev 13:16. Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, 17. so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. 18. This calls for wisdom: let him who has understanding reckon the number of the beast, for it is a human number, its number is six hundred and sixty-six.

Variant! In some editions, the number is six hundred sixteen! This is significant to claiming an identity of �The Beast� for the number designates the name of a man. Remember that the Revelation is originally written in Greek. Consider the Greek �name� of the sixth head, Neron Caesar:

?[20]???[200]??[100]?[70]?[6] ?[50]??[100]?[70]?[50] = 666.

(Kaisaros Neron, �Caesar Nero� in English letters)

The proof of this identity is in the variant reading. The number 616 (rather than 666) comes from the Latin version of the Revelation translated by St. Jerome and issued in 410. Jerome knew the exact identity of the Beast. In the Latin language, the man�s name is not Caesar Neron, but Caesar Nero. Loss of the �n� in the translation also subtracts 50 from the total of the Greek letters, leaving us with 616! Nero is the 6th head and his name adds up to 666 when written in Greek and 616 when in Latin.

Who Is The Beast?

Spaz · 04-03-2003, 12:52 PM

So the christians were just scared shitless of nero

mike_decock · 04-03-2003, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Spaz
So the christians were just scared shitless of nero

Well, wouldn't you be? He was a pretty nasty dude.

-Mike...

Hawkingfan · 04-03-2003, 01:11 PM

I always found the idea that 666 is some kind of bad or satanic number interesting. According to satanists, it means absolutely nothing. To them, the most satanic or "bad" number is 9.

mike_decock · 04-03-2003, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hawkingfan
I always found the idea that 666 is some kind of bad or satanic number interesting. According to satanists, it means absolutely nothing. To them, the most satanic or "bad" number is 9.

I've never heard that about Satanists. Why 9?

-Mike...

Spaz · 04-03-2003, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mike_decock
Well, wouldn't you be? He was a pretty nasty dude.

Indeed he was. Why do christians still spout revelation crap when it's not really hard to see that this evil man died over 2000 years ago?

mike_decock · 04-03-2003, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Spaz
Indeed he was. Why do christians still spout revelation crap when it's not really hard to see that this evil man died over 2000 years ago?

The answer to that question is in the verse:

Revelation 13:18
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

How many Christians have wisdom and understanding? How many modern day Christians know anything about ancient history?

Don't forget that the second to last verse says:

Revelation 22:20
He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

I don't think anyone considers 1900 years "quickly".

It goes back to that "faith" thing. They believed that Nero was "the beast". When it turned out that the prediction in Revelation didn't come true within their lifetimes, the next generation believed that "the beast" must refer to someone in the future, maybe even within their lifetime. When it turned out that the prediction in Revelation didn't come true within their lifetimes, the next generation believed that "the beast" must refer to someone in the future, maybe even within their lifetime. Ad Nauseum...

-Mike...

Hawkingfan · 04-03-2003, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mike_decock
I've never heard that about Satanists. Why 9?

-Mike...

Not sure exactly. I do recall hearing Anton LaVey say it once. Also, there are 9 "Satanic Statements" of the Satanic Church (documented in the Satanic Bible).

A side note--One time, I saw the "Schoolhouse Rock" program on TV and it was doing a song about the number 9. The song was called "Nasty Number Nine". I wonder if the songwriter had heard that 9 is satanic as well. ???

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04-03-2003, 12:52 PM	#4
Spaz Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: 6th Circle of Hell Posts: 1,093	So the christians were just scared shitless of nero

04-03-2003, 01:11 PM	#6
Hawkingfan Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,247	I always found the idea that 666 is some kind of bad or satanic number interesting. According to satanists, it means absolutely nothing. To them, the most satanic or "bad" number is 9.

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