Stormy

Hi! I am new to this site. But I have spoken with several Atheist and Agnostics on the Christian Forum.

Maybe it is because this is your home territory... I have noticed a difference in the nature of the Atheist that post here.

For it is not only that you disbelieve in God and feel that you have found the truth... it appears that you have an earnest desire to spread your message and thus clear the world of faith in God.

I have read post from mothers of Christian children who do not want them to be baptized. I have read other post that claim the Christian as an enemy because of government persuasion.

It seems that you are doing what you wrongfully fault the Christians for... trying to influence the minds of others with false tales.

This leads me to believe that the happy atheist whose motto is... live and let live... is a fabrication.

Tell me what you think...

GaryP

I would be happy to "live and let live". I just do not want my govt. telling (or implying) that what I choose to believe or not believe is wrong.

If you think that some of us are a little "militant" I think you are correct.

But place yourself in our shoes.

What if, on every coin or bill you use, it said "Don't Trust God"?

What if, every time you said the pledge, it included the words "one Nation NOT under God" ?

What if, on practically every corner of your hometown there were Atheist churches that did not pay any taxes?


What if, practically all politicians gave at least lip service to those who don't believe?

Would you perhaps get a little annoyed?

Godot

Welcome, and thanks for stopping by!

I can only speak for myself, but I'm just as quick to call bullshit if you profess belief in the j/c god, the IPU, santa claus, ufo's, or holistic medicine. Or really any belief that requires an explanation beyond the natural environment. I won't call you on it unless you thrust it in my face. Sure, I think that the world would be far better off if we gave up believing in antiquated tribal superstitions, but I don;t delude myself into believing that this will happen during my lifetime.

Be careful that you do not paint us all with the same brush. Some people are more vociferous in their objections and activism against religion than others. Their reasons for doing so may be just as strong as yours are for spreading the faith.

To avoid flying off the handle into a strawman, please list the "false tales" you are accusing us of spreading. Until then, this part of the conversation cannot continue.

I smell a strawman...
I have yet to meet ANYONE, atheist or theist, who espoused a motto of any kind, let alone "live and let live." As I said above, I won't refute your beliefs unless you thrust them in my face. The minute you place your opinion in the public realm, it's fair game. If you can't handle it: tough titties.

I think I've done so, more or less. I'm reserving some of my more polemic opinions for later.

Oxymoron

I feel a quiet but sustained rage that the vast majority of my fellow humans on this planet blight the lives of all around them with their self-righteous baloney. Freedom of belief is all very well. But religion sets a precedent that it is OK to believe any old rubbish that makes you feel good about yourself, irrespective of the wider consequences of that belief.

I genuinely want the world to be a freer, more tolerant, happier, more rational place where people live with reality, warts and all. Religion, along with its cousins UFOs, ESP, astrology and New Age Hokum take us - IMHO - further from that goal. And are therefore to be opposed.

GunnerJ

Good to meet you.

It's possible some of us do. But it's folly to try and pin down what a group of people believe only on a shared lack of belief. You wouldn't say that all non-Republicans believe one thing, or that all non-communists have the same goals for government. So you would do well to be careful in making assumptions about what "we" want based solely on the fact that "we" are all non-believers in god(s).

I am only aware of one poster that has a discussion going on such a subject. However, this is an issue best taken up with the mother(s) in question. It's not neccessarily indicative of the beliefs of all atheists, or even of all atheist mothers.

Which post was this? I don't doubt that some atheists, somewhere, hold such views. But I think it's likely that the post in question is legitimately complaining about government agencies such as public schools overstepping their constitutionally defined bounds in requiring religious indoctrination of students. However, I can't accurately comment on the post without more specifics.

This confuses me. Where have you shown that atheists, sum total, combined together as a unified group solely on shared nonbelief in god(s), are spreading false tales?

Why? Do you know that any of the specific atheists you criticized held such a motto? Have you shown that these idividuals do not want to let people live as they wish? I remain unconvinced, for myself.

Stormy

Thank you all for your responses.

I think it is good to rid ourselves of any extra baggage caused by mis-understanding.

Do you see me as a wart on society?

Do you really think that this world would be a better place without faith in God?

Do you endeavor then to destroy the faith of a believer?


And if you answer yes to all this ...

Then how can you claim that you are not preaching a faulty gospel that leads to death?

Eudaimonist

Hi, Stormy!

Possible, though not necessarily. It depends on what sort of cultural values and underlying ideas would replace those of the current culture. It could be better or worse, though I think that "better" is a significant possibility.

Me personally? No. I might debate a Christian on some issue, but I don't have the first clue on how to deconvert a Christian. In any event, this is not a goal of mine. I am more focused on living a good life according to my philosophy and values than worrying about what other people think.

philechat

Good. Welcome.
No one is a wart because of what they believes. Only behaviors matter in my opinion, so the belief in Christianity does not become "a wart in society" until the Christians try to influence government policies on Church-State seperation and science education.
Not necessarily. But I think the world would be a better place if people endorse religious pluralism. Like the Hindus and the East Asian Buddhists if you know what I am speaking of--that hopefully the believers will not consider non-believers morally deficient or dangerous, and that people of different religions can live together (including being in the same family and in marriage).
No, unless they are actively trying to proselytize me. I think non-believers should at least be granted the respect given to Jews in terms of proselytism.
What? I did not answer yes to any of the above questions. I just wonder why the Christians are so hung-up with exclusive salvation that they see people who believe otherwise as "leading to death". Do you think the Hindus are damned? Or the Buddhists? Or the Muslims?

Stormy

Then you surely are not a candidate for a high office in "Atheism the Anti-religion Religion".

But still I have not been persuaded to believe that there are not many who secretly belong to this unproclaimed faith.

Godot

Your wartiness is determined by how you comport yourself in public and in your interactions with others, religious beliefs notwithstanding.

Since I'm not a moral absolutist, I don't see how a world without god could necessarily be worse than the one we have right now.

It depends on how severe a case of cranial-rectal inversion you suffer from. The more pig-headed you are, the more likely I am to go for the jugular. If you're a reasonable individual, then of course not. Deconversion is not my MO.


Non-sequitur. Might I ask what your denominational affiliations are?