kdr

If we are unable to source the origin of the very matter that was needed to create the so called big bang, this leads all questions about the origin of the universe and subsequent development of life superfluous. To me this is the big question. The argument against the existence of God by offering the argument, well who created God, which seems behond our logic, can equally be answered with the question, who created the first matter that started the ball rolling. If this question cannot be answered then all belief systoms are up for grabs.

Skydancer

So many mistakes, so little time.... and what does this have to do with evolution in the first place? You're on the wrong board for this question.

But I can't let the last statement pass. All belief systems are not created equal. Even if you don't know the answer to a question, there are still some answers that are simply wrong.

PJPSYCO

kdr,

You need to actually read a book on the big bang. Unless it is a very poor source, it should tell you that the matter comes from energy. The name big bang is actually a joke from when the theory was first presented (another scientist asked "So, it comes from some sort of big bang?"). The creation of matter is covered in how the elements form from base subatomic particles, and other elements, through fusion pathways. Basically once energy was created it couldn't be released except by this pathway.

Magus55

But then his question still stands, of what created that energy in the first place, since energy can't destroy or create itself. It was either created by an outside force, or always existed. But as has been said by atheists before on this board, if something leaves behind no physical evidence, its not true. There is absolutely no case or evidence supporting energy being able to always exist - its an assumption because scientists can't think of anything better.

Doubting Didymus

Anyone who thinks they know about quantum physics, knows nothing about quantum physics.

NZAmoeba

Magus: how about the evidence that energy cannot create or destroy itself? (a theory you appear to accept) If it can't be created or destroyed, then naturally it must have always existed.

ChrisW

this is a paradox.

the real truth is that we have no idea what was happening at T=0 much less anything that could have occured before it.

NZAmoeba

spose... but thats assumeing T ever equalled 0

My own personal pulled-out-of-my-arse theory is that the universe has been creating and destroying itself an infinite number of times, expanding then collapseing, expanding again, then repeat infinitely. Then you don't have to think of the nothingness beforehand because then it would have never existed ever.

Gawdawful

Oh, no! We're all going to die! ............eventually that is.

Warren in Oklahoma

NZAmoeba

It would be cool to watch if it wouldn't be such a giant event as to be too big for our own eyes to see (let alone everything becoming uninhabitable)

Black holes slowly munching up galaxies, then being drawn by each others gravity till the now giant black holes swirl into a central point like water going down the drain, all mass collecting into one tiny spot.... then BLAM it explodes and a new universe is born.

Who needs a god hunh?