Freethought & Rationalism Archive

winstonjen · 11-26-2002, 08:07 PM

I'm sure we're all aware of paedophiles in the Catholic church that justify their celibacy oath with things like "We's only prohibited from having vaginal sex." Or the even more popular "Jesus forgives me, I won't do it again."

And they go and do it AGAIN! How many second chances do they get? According to the Gospels, infinite chances! It seems that they break their own rules even more AFTER they become a Christian! LOL!

Wave Man · 11-27-2002, 07:51 AM

Well... of course you get second chances, if you truly believe you did wrong, repent in your heart, and want to do better. I don't think you'd be forgiven just saying "God is forgiving!" and hope he forgives you even if you don't believe you did wrong. Of course He is forgiving, but if you truly don't believe you need the forgiveness....well..

At least, that's my initial reaction.

winstonjen · 11-27-2002, 11:51 AM

Well, if the pedophile priests really had faith in their own teachings, they wouldn't repeatedly break their own laws.

NOGO · 11-27-2002, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Well... of course you get second chances, if you truly believe you did wrong, repent in your heart, and want to do better.

It is not up to the victims to forgive?

winstonjen · 11-27-2002, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NOGO:


It is not up to the victims to forgive?

It certainly SHOULD be, since they're being directly affected by it. IMO, God is interfering in everyone else's life far too much by saying that He is offended by certain 'sins'.

Sojourner553 · 11-27-2002, 06:25 PM

According to Christian dogma, the only sin God doesn't forgive...

is not believing in Him...

this despite the fact he gives no proof of his existance and throughout history his believers have fought--even to the death-- quibbling over the smallest details of what his "will" really means.

Sojourner

winstonjen · 11-27-2002, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sojourner553:
According to Christian dogma, the only sin God doesn't forgive...

is not believing in Him...

Sojourner

There's also a verse saying how it is unforgivable to badmouth the Holy Spirit, but it is forgivable to badmouth Jesus. But since the Father, Son and Holy Ghost are supposed to be part of the same being, how does this make sense?

Bob K · 11-30-2002, 08:24 PM

How about doing some simple sleuthwork with an eye on human nature.

We've got Bernard Law and McCormack covering up priest molestation problems.

Why?

To avoid embarassing the church? Maybe.

How about this one: Because each has knowledge of the homosexual activities of the others, and, since no one wants to risk exposure, everyone plays Coverup.

Human nature would work in avoiding embarassing the church, but avoiding exposure of one's own misconduct is perhaps the more logical, the more serious, and the more consistent with human nature.

winstonjen · 11-30-2002, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob K:

Human nature would work in avoiding embarassing the church, but avoiding exposure of one's own misconduct is perhaps the more logical, the more serious, and the more consistent with human nature.

Yup. It also shows how self-serving they really are.

lpetrich · 11-30-2002, 11:04 PM

That single unforgivable sin is, according to Matthew 12:32, speaking against the Holy Ghost. Thus, if you say

You Holy Ghost, you are nothing but a spook!

that will never be forgiven. I don't think that simple denial of its existence would qualify, unless the Biblical God is extremely thin-skinned.

11-26-2002, 08:07 PM	#1
winstonjen Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,425	Using Jesus as an Excuse to Sin I'm sure we're all aware of paedophiles in the Catholic church that justify their celibacy oath with things like "We's only prohibited from having vaginal sex." Or the even more popular "Jesus forgives me, I won't do it again." And they go and do it AGAIN! How many second chances do they get? According to the Gospels, infinite chances! It seems that they break their own rules even more AFTER they become a Christian! LOL!

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11-27-2002, 07:51 AM	#2
Wave Man Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 5	Well... of course you get second chances, if you truly believe you did wrong, repent in your heart, and want to do better. I don't think you'd be forgiven just saying "God is forgiving!" and hope he forgives you even if you don't believe you did wrong. Of course He is forgiving, but if you truly don't believe you need the forgiveness....well.. At least, that's my initial reaction.

11-27-2002, 11:51 AM	#3
winstonjen Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,425	Well, if the pedophile priests really had faith in their own teachings, they wouldn't repeatedly break their own laws.

11-27-2002, 06:25 PM	#6
Sojourner553 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Southern US Posts: 817	According to Christian dogma, the only sin God doesn't forgive... is not believing in Him... this despite the fact he gives no proof of his existance and throughout history his believers have fought--even to the death-- quibbling over the smallest details of what his "will" really means. Sojourner

11-30-2002, 08:24 PM	#8
Bob K Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: New Durham, NH USA Posts: 5,933	How about doing some simple sleuthwork with an eye on human nature. We've got Bernard Law and McCormack covering up priest molestation problems. Why? To avoid embarassing the church? Maybe. How about this one: Because each has knowledge of the homosexual activities of the others, and, since no one wants to risk exposure, everyone plays Coverup. Human nature would work in avoiding embarassing the church, but avoiding exposure of one's own misconduct is perhaps the more logical, the more serious, and the more consistent with human nature.

11-30-2002, 11:04 PM	#10
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	That single unforgivable sin is, according to Matthew 12:32, speaking against the Holy Ghost. Thus, if you say You Holy Ghost, you are nothing but a spook! that will never be forgiven. I don't think that simple denial of its existence would qualify, unless the Biblical God is extremely thin-skinned.

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