Thor Q. Mada

Just tell me where I am wrong,

Imagine an eternal being, whom someday for reasons only known to him, gets the unlikely idea to create us ?? (for what?? a test case for genetic engineering??)
More unlikely even he decides to create us the way he looks. (poor guy!!)
The question is:
Logically speaking an eternal being would live on an entirely different time scale than us. Therefor it would be inpossible for him to follow what we were doing.
I mean we, in his time frame we have been on earth a fraction of his time only. (It is even worse if we look at the rediculous 6000 years from the fundies).
There is a paradox between our existence and the existence of an eternally living creator.
In short we and him are living at entirely different speeds.

Please go ahead.

Keith Russell

Thor:

You seem to be looking for a rational explanation for theological claims based on irrational premises.

The fact that you have not yet been able to reconcile theological claims, with reality as science currently understands it, should give you a clue that there is something fundamentally wrong with theological thinking.

Keith.

Amos

Are you trying to tell us that God is eternal?

An eternal being lives outside the illusion of time and perhaps in the real world that science is trying to penetrate.

Is that what you mean?

[ September 15, 2002: Message edited by: Amos ]</p>

Jobar

Amos:
"Are you trying to tell us god is <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=47&t=001098" target="_blank">Eternal</a>?"

Sorry, couldn't resist.

I think that our language is simply incapable of saying anything meaningful about eternity. We can't even say if it exists or not. This renders all our words and thoughts about a notionally eternal god meaningless.

Amos

But that is not true at all Jobar because we coined the word and sure did not need God's help to do that.

Eternal makes reference to our existence in the absense of time as opposite to our existence in the presense of time. In our left brain we exist in the presense of time and in our right brain we exist in the absense of time.

To be eternal requires existence first and since God has no corporeal existene (of being) God can not be eternal or temporal.

God is love made manifest in Lord God and Lord God exists in eternity and in eternity only. For us to become eternal requires of us to become Lord God in person.

[ September 15, 2002: Message edited by: Amos ]</p>

Thor Q. Mada

Keith, Amos,

Sorry but I should have told you I am laughing with the preposterous and arrogant god idea, and my topic is just what in german is called provocative "spielerei".

garthoverman

I contend that time in and of itself is as fictional as Jehovah. Time does not exist: its merely a pattern of our own perceptive mechanisms. It seems time elapses, we use movements and cycles to parcel out our experience and label moments for convenient recall and reference but basically everything happens at once: Now.

Check out this:
<a href="http://www.journaloftheoretics.com/Editorials/Vol-3/e3-1.htm" target="_blank">Time Does Not Exist</a>
Its a little skimpy on the details though.

With that in mind, everything is eternal which exists Now.

Yours,

Garth

[ September 16, 2002: Message edited by: garthoverman ]</p>

Keith Russell

Greetings:

'Time' is the recognition of the relationship between differing rates of change.

'Time' exists much as the concept 'justice' exists.

Neither are 'physical' states, but simply the recognition that certain events share a common principle.

Keith.

garthoverman

I stand corrected. Time, as a concept, exists. As an objective characteristic of the universe, it does not.

Yours,

Garth

Uni-Universe

I agree with you completely. It is perfectly plausible that a non-human (supreme being) would exist beyond space and time. This being would not be confined to space and time like human beings are.