Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Boro Nut · 12-23-2002, 04:11 AM

Q: - If a tree falls in a forest and there is no one there, does it make a sound?
A: - Yes. Indeed it does.

Q: - What is the sound of one hand clapping.
A: - It sounds like a very quite baby clap, unless you have a castanet, in which case it sounds like a Shetland pony trying not to piss on it’s feet.

The uninitiated may well conclude that Zen Buddhism can be characterised as a spiritual journey in which devotees pursue an age-long quest to achieve personal enlightenment of the nature of sound. My deep suspicion is that it was founded by someone who was profoundly deaf.

In their hilltop monasteries, the monks can cut themselves off from the intrusions and distractions of contemporary life and devote their time to quite contemplation of the deeper mysteries. Unfortunately, if the sound of a tree falling in a forest is a deep mystery to them, it bodes ill for their chances of success. If they are still stuck on sound after all this time, what hope have they of progressing to, say, the atom?

The nature of sound is a mystery to no one. The laws of physics are long established, and in the words of Newton himself “Ye cannea change ‘em”. Perhaps they would be better served building their monasteries in the forest instead of on mountain tops, where the sound of falling trees would become second nature to them. They could then devote their time more profitably to considering the meaning of life, the tax benefits of obtaining charitable status, and whether songs might not sound better with at least two notes

Ta-ta for Xmas
Boro Nut

Living Dead Chipmunk · 12-23-2002, 02:21 PM

What did your original face look like before you were born?

Somehow, you missed that koan. Among about 50 others that are less 'soundbitable' than the two any idiot with a computer and a chip on his shoulder could find on a Simpson's website.

Further, you're wrong about the sound. The tree falling produces waves in the air, but without an ear or brain to interperet those waves, they're not sound. Just waves.

Mageth · 12-23-2002, 02:29 PM

(yet another poster who doesn't get the subtle humor of some of Boro Nut's posts...)

ldc: What kind of waves? What do we call "waves in the air?" Sound waves, right? Sound waves affect other things than eardrums, you know.

12-23-2002, 03:42 PM

What's this topic all about? I read "Zen Buddhism" on the topic header but I don't see anything but load of crap inside ...

Does anyone know what Zen Buddhism is? I don't mean some 3rd party defination or from some dictionary either.

Living Dead Chipmunk · 12-23-2002, 06:18 PM

Only because we CALL them 'sound' waves, Mageth. Without a brain to interpret them, what are they? Just compaction and rarification of air molecules.

Answerer · 12-23-2002, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Seraphim:
<strong>

Does anyone know what Zen Buddhism is? I don't mean some 3rd party defination or from some dictionary either.</strong>

Zen is a wind that blow from east to west.

12-23-2002, 07:30 PM

Zen is a wind that blow from east to west.

My reply : Don't catch cold then ...

I always have this notion that one person's philosphy and way of thinking doesn't suit another.

What you guys thinks about the concept of Zasshin in Zen Buddhism? You can find what it means (for those who doesn't know) on the Net.

phaedrus · 12-23-2002, 07:52 PM

And what is good, .......,
And what is not good...
Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?

12-23-2002, 07:59 PM

By phaedrus

And what is good, .......,
And what is not good...
Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?

My reply : Nothing is good or bad, all in ones' understanding and how he or she uses it.

Buddhism (among other religions) brought great changes (social, politics etc) in the East, but whether such changes will take place in the West is unknown simply because no one could predict how a society will behave in the future.

Buddhism is like a good recipe, but no matter how good it is, if a bad cook get hold of it, it will become bad meal.

Waning Moon Conrad · 12-23-2002, 09:08 PM

What really annoys me is harpsichord builders.

Every time I think about them I pace about huffing and puffing in a state of mellow fury.

I swear, these people are so preoccupied with soundboards, jacks, string gauges etc that they're never going to get around to splitting the atom and explaining the big bang.

Don't let me get started on motor mechanics!

Motor mechanics! I swear, these people are so blah blah blah blah etc.

12-23-2002, 04:11 AM	#1
Boro Nut Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Middlesbrough, England Posts: 3,909	The Essence of Zen Buddhism Q: - If a tree falls in a forest and there is no one there, does it make a sound? A: - Yes. Indeed it does. Q: - What is the sound of one hand clapping. A: - It sounds like a very quite baby clap, unless you have a castanet, in which case it sounds like a Shetland pony trying not to piss on it’s feet. The uninitiated may well conclude that Zen Buddhism can be characterised as a spiritual journey in which devotees pursue an age-long quest to achieve personal enlightenment of the nature of sound. My deep suspicion is that it was founded by someone who was profoundly deaf. In their hilltop monasteries, the monks can cut themselves off from the intrusions and distractions of contemporary life and devote their time to quite contemplation of the deeper mysteries. Unfortunately, if the sound of a tree falling in a forest is a deep mystery to them, it bodes ill for their chances of success. If they are still stuck on sound after all this time, what hope have they of progressing to, say, the atom? The nature of sound is a mystery to no one. The laws of physics are long established, and in the words of Newton himself “Ye cannea change ‘em”. Perhaps they would be better served building their monasteries in the forest instead of on mountain tops, where the sound of falling trees would become second nature to them. They could then devote their time more profitably to considering the meaning of life, the tax benefits of obtaining charitable status, and whether songs might not sound better with at least two notes Ta-ta for Xmas Boro Nut

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12-23-2002, 02:21 PM	#2
Living Dead Chipmunk Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: South Carolina Posts: 312	What did your original face look like before you were born? Somehow, you missed that koan. Among about 50 others that are less 'soundbitable' than the two any idiot with a computer and a chip on his shoulder could find on a Simpson's website. Further, you're wrong about the sound. The tree falling produces waves in the air, but without an ear or brain to interperet those waves, they're not sound. Just waves.

12-23-2002, 02:29 PM	#3
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	(yet another poster who doesn't get the subtle humor of some of Boro Nut's posts...) ldc: What kind of waves? What do we call "waves in the air?" Sound waves, right? Sound waves affect other things than eardrums, you know.

12-23-2002, 03:42 PM	#4
Seraphim Guest Posts: n/a	What's this topic all about? I read "Zen Buddhism" on the topic header but I don't see anything but load of crap inside ... Does anyone know what Zen Buddhism is? I don't mean some 3rd party defination or from some dictionary either.

12-23-2002, 06:18 PM	#5
Living Dead Chipmunk Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: South Carolina Posts: 312	Only because we CALL them 'sound' waves, Mageth. Without a brain to interpret them, what are they? Just compaction and rarification of air molecules.

12-23-2002, 07:30 PM	#7
Seraphim Guest Posts: n/a	Zen is a wind that blow from east to west. My reply : Don't catch cold then ... I always have this notion that one person's philosphy and way of thinking doesn't suit another. What you guys thinks about the concept of Zasshin in Zen Buddhism? You can find what it means (for those who doesn't know) on the Net.

12-23-2002, 07:52 PM	#8
phaedrus Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Indus Posts: 1,038	And what is good, ......., And what is not good... Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?

12-23-2002, 07:59 PM	#9
Seraphim Guest Posts: n/a	By phaedrus And what is good, ......., And what is not good... Need we ask anyone to tell us these things? My reply : Nothing is good or bad, all in ones' understanding and how he or she uses it. Buddhism (among other religions) brought great changes (social, politics etc) in the East, but whether such changes will take place in the West is unknown simply because no one could predict how a society will behave in the future. Buddhism is like a good recipe, but no matter how good it is, if a bad cook get hold of it, it will become bad meal.

12-23-2002, 09:08 PM	#10
Waning Moon Conrad Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Victoria. Australia Posts: 1,417	What really annoys me is harpsichord builders. Every time I think about them I pace about huffing and puffing in a state of mellow fury. I swear, these people are so preoccupied with soundboards, jacks, string gauges etc that they're never going to get around to splitting the atom and explaining the big bang. Don't let me get started on motor mechanics! Motor mechanics! I swear, these people are so blah blah blah blah etc.

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