notMichaelJackson

Awaits the creation of the Christian evolution organization "Answers in Evolution..."

conkermaniac

Congrats, Magus! You win the award for the unsubstantiated claim of the day. :banghead:

Oolon Colluphid

Yeah, right...

TTFN, Oolon

conundrum

Since you're joking about the world day, I'm sure you already know that the word day was translated from was "yom," which can also mean 1000 years. Since according to the Bible Adam did live to be 930 years old, he did die that day.

And you forgot one of our best excuses. You and I are dying right now...well..I don't know maybe you're immortal. (are you?) Up until Adam and Eve ate from the tree they were to live forever. But after they ate of the tree they were doomed to die a physical death and began dying just like you an me.

Finally, dude, magnus. What's with the one liner there?

Mageth

And you forgot one of our best excuses. You and I are dying right now...well..I don't know maybe you're immortal. (are you?) Up until Adam and Eve ate from the tree they were to live forever. But after they ate of the tree they were doomed to die a physical death and began dying just like you an me.

OK, where's the biblical support for A&E being immortal before eating the fruit? I don't recall reading that in the Bible anywhere; it sounds like a bit of extrabiblical invention to me.

I seem to remember another tree in the Garden, however, IIRC the Tree of (Eternal) Life, and that God kicked A&E out of the Garden so that they would not eat of the fruit of that tree, live forever, and "become like us". Which suggests that they were not immortal.

Mageth

Since you're joking about the world day, I'm sure you already know that the word day was translated from was "yom," which can also mean 1000 years. Since according to the Bible Adam did live to be 930 years old, he did die that day.

Actually, the Hebrew in that verse is yowm. And, according to Strongs, it may mean a literal day or a figurative period of time (not, specifically, 1000 years). I can't attest as to the accuracy of that, not being an expert in Hebrew.

Jimmy Higgins

Ouch, that's weak. Only Adam and Eve were booted from the garden. Therefore, they must have had Cain and Abel, then Cain slew Abel, then they had Seth, and many others who shall remain unnamed. Therefore, it is extremely unlikely that Adam could have died once being banished from Paradise.

God didn't lie, he changed his mind. He also clothed them as they left the Garden. This compasionate conservatism would later be witnessed with Cain's punishment but also protection, the "Great" Flood which saw the new covanent (2nd of 4 so far), the Tower of Babel which saw the new covanent (3rd of 4 so far). All of god's punishments are nearly immediately followed by compassion. Therefore, that Adam and Eve did not die is not a sign of a "spirtual death", but rather that god changed his mind.

Of course, we could always say that the whole death thing goes back to a much older story where the snake is the hero and god is the antagonist, go fig.

djmullen

someone: And you forgot one of our best excuses. You and I are dying right now...well..I don't know maybe you're immortal. (are you?) Up until Adam and Eve ate from the tree they were to live forever. But after they ate of the tree they were doomed to die a physical death and began dying just like you an me.


Mageth: OK, where's the biblical support for A&E being immortal before eating the fruit? I don't recall reading that in the Bible anywhere; it sounds like a bit of extrabiblical invention to me.

I seem to remember another tree in the Garden, however, IIRC the Tree of (Eternal) Life, and that God kicked A&E out of the Garden so that they would not eat of the fruit of that tree, live forever, and "become like us". Which suggests that they were not immortal.

DJM: Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.

Mageth

conundrum said
Since you're joking about the world day, I'm sure you already know that the word day was translated from was "yom," which can also mean 1000 years. Since according to the Bible Adam did live to be 930 years old, he did die that day.

I replied:
Actually, the Hebrew in that verse is yowm. And, according to Strongs, it may mean a literal day or a figurative period of time (not, specifically, 1000 years). I can't attest as to the accuracy of that, not being an expert in Hebrew.

I wanted to add that, if you substitute the figurative "period of time" into the text in question, it doesnt' make much sense.

"...for in the [period of time] that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

But note that Strong's Hebrew Dictionary also makes this comment: "figurative (a space of time defined by an associated term),"

So, where is the associated term that would define yowm as anything but a literal day? That's homework for the apologists, if they wish to undertake it.

Sometimes a cigar is simply a cigar.

Jayjay

The idea is based on something Paul said, so it's not necessarily extrabiblical. But I agree with you that this interpretation doesn't come from Genesis... it's depressing to see a perfectly good myth ruined by post hoc rationalizations.