Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Ganymede · 03-03-2003, 05:40 PM

As a British citizen living in New Zealand (a very secular place, despite no constitutional separation of church and state) I am always amazed at how very religious the US seems to be. From reading the posts in this board I get the impression that every second person in the US is a rabid fundy, where as here church, god, religion, etc seems to play a very small part in people lives. Most of the people I know only go to church at Xmas and you rarely hear people discussing their religion at all. I guess that most folks would profess some vague belief, but it just doesn�t seem important to them. So my question is this � how is it that places like the UK and New Zealand are apparently �less Christian� than the US? What is the difference? Or is it just that I have a false view of the US, and hang with the wrong people here at home?

David.

PS: Don�t tell George W about this. I wouldn�t want him to put NZ on his shit list along with Iraq!

Thor Q. Mada · 03-03-2003, 06:12 PM

This also counts for the rest of Europe. Only a few years ago, I discovered that there are idiots who take the creation story serious.
Around that same time, I discovered the dangerous religious blindness and fanatism in the US. I came as a shock to me.
This kind of thinking is quite allien in Europe. I then started noticing my American friends saying "god bless" to me. They might have said this before, but I might just not have noticed this. It is quite unsettling. I mean, what do you reply. I don't want to be blessed. If you think blessing works then cursing does too.
The worst thing is, religion seems to be on the winning hand in the US, at least in circles where it matters.
I also cannot believe the incredible arrogance of thinking that god if any is on your side. Why would that be?? Any evidence of this??

Tercel · 03-03-2003, 07:44 PM

Yeah I'm constantly amazed by it also! There's something about Americans and religion which is just wacko.

Radorth · 03-03-2003, 10:09 PM

Even with all those horrid "fundies" running around, with the gall to actually mention God, people bypassed Australia, France, Germany and England and came by the millions because

A. It was started by "deists" who thought Jesus the greatest moral teacher in the world

B. It is populated by people who actually follow the teachings of Jesus by, for example, feeding and rebuilding former enemy states.

C. American soldiers actually read the Bible, and didn't rape their women

D. They weren't looking for the socialists free lunch but preferred to earn their way among "fundies"

E. There are no democratic Muslim nations

F. They realized laws aren't much use without an internal policeman and knew the history of atheist states.

G. All of the above

Rad

Doubting Didymus · 03-03-2003, 10:19 PM

Now if only any of those things were true.

Ganymede · 03-04-2003, 01:54 AM

Even with all those horrid "fundies" running around, with the gall to actually mention God, people bypassed Australia, France, Germany and England and came by the millions because

A. It was started by "deists" who thought Jesus the greatest moral teacher in the world

Care to cite some sources for this?

B. It is populated by people who actually follow the teachings of Jesus by, for example, feeding and rebuilding former enemy states.

Oh right! You mean like taking slaves, yes?

C. American soldiers actually read the Bible, and didn't rape their women

Shame that the bible is silent on the morality of rape.

D. They weren't looking for the socialists free lunch but preferred to earn their way among "fundies"

I think you will find that a very large proportion of American migrants arrived there before the advent of socialism (in around 1912?)

E. There are no democratic Muslim nations

Which has exactly nothing to do with the question. Besides which Malaysians would disagree with you. Ditto Indonesians. These might be young and some might say imperfect democracies but that's what they are.

F. They realized laws aren't much use without an internal policeman and knew the history of atheist states.

Which atheist states did you have in mind - none of the 4 you mention qualify. Not sure about Germany but France is Catholic and the UK and Australia both have the Queen as Head of State and she is also head of the C of E. No State / Church separation there. The US on the other hand constitutionally takes no position on the existence of God or shows any preference for any particular God. Depending on your definition of the terms, I guess that makes it either agnostic or atheist.

G. All of the above

As an example of reasoned response to a perfectly legitimate question this entire post rates an F. On the other hand, it's as good an example of xenophobic toy tossing as I have seen for a while.

David.

malookiemaloo · 03-04-2003, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Thor Q. Mada
This also counts for the rest of Europe. Only a few years ago, I discovered that there are idiots who take the creation story serious.
Around that same time, I discovered the dangerous religious blindness and fanatism in the US. I came as a shock to me.
This kind of thinking is quite allien in Europe. I then started noticing my American friends saying "god bless" to me. They might have said this before, but I might just not have noticed this. It is quite unsettling. I mean, what do you reply. I don't want to be blessed. If you think blessing works then cursing does too.
The worst thing is, religion seems to be on the winning hand in the US, at least in circles where it matters.
I also cannot believe the incredible arrogance of thinking that god if any is on your side. Why would that be?? Any evidence of this??

Please don't judge all Christians by American standards! Anyway, I visited USA last year and thought the Churches I attended were great! No fanaticism or dogma. Friendly welcome and biblical preaching. Good churches do exist you know.

Anyway, what do expect if you drive on the right hand side of the road?

malookiemaloo

Hayden · 03-04-2003, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth Even with all those horrid "fundies" running around, with the gall to actually mention God, people bypassed Australia, France, Germany and England and came by the millions because

A. It was started by "deists" who thought Jesus the greatest moral teacher in the world

Some of them did, anyway.

Quote:

B. It is populated by people who actually follow the teachings of Jesus by, for example, feeding and rebuilding former enemy states.

While hating their mothers and fathers? Or can we ignore that particular teaching of Jesus?

Quote:

C. American soldiers actually read the Bible, and didn't rape their women

Yes, while other countries' recruitment posters read "Join the Army! Rape some women!"

Quote:

D. They weren't looking for the socialists free lunch but preferred to earn their way among "fundies"

How is everyone working together for the common good a "free lunch"?

Quote:

E. There are no democratic Muslim nations

Turkey, anyone?

Quote:

F. They realized laws aren't much use without an internal policeman and knew the history of atheist states.

If you need god to tell you what's right and wrong, then I feel sorry for you.

Quote:

G. All of the above

H. Gold? (not any more)

I. Preferential treatment for Protestants?

Stop whining about not being allowed to mention God. When was the last time anyone censured you for doing so?

HR

PS Ganymede, welcome. You are hanging around with the wrong people: Aucklanders!

Ganymede · 03-04-2003, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hayden
PS Ganymede, welcome. You are hanging around with the wrong people: Aucklanders!

LOL - coming from a Wellingtonian I find that a liitle hard to take!

But thanks for the welcome anyway!

Tercel · 03-06-2003, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hayden
PS Ganymede, welcome. You are hanging around with the wrong people: Aucklanders!

I second that!

I'm from Christchurch myself.

03-03-2003, 05:40 PM	#1
Ganymede Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Auckland Posts: 58	Religious / Non religous countries As a British citizen living in New Zealand (a very secular place, despite no constitutional separation of church and state) I am always amazed at how very religious the US seems to be. From reading the posts in this board I get the impression that every second person in the US is a rabid fundy, where as here church, god, religion, etc seems to play a very small part in people lives. Most of the people I know only go to church at Xmas and you rarely hear people discussing their religion at all. I guess that most folks would profess some vague belief, but it just doesn�t seem important to them. So my question is this � how is it that places like the UK and New Zealand are apparently �less Christian� than the US? What is the difference? Or is it just that I have a false view of the US, and hang with the wrong people here at home? David. PS: Don�t tell George W about this. I wouldn�t want him to put NZ on his shit list along with Iraq!

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

03-03-2003, 06:12 PM	#2
Thor Q. Mada Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Asia Posts: 3,558	This also counts for the rest of Europe. Only a few years ago, I discovered that there are idiots who take the creation story serious. Around that same time, I discovered the dangerous religious blindness and fanatism in the US. I came as a shock to me. This kind of thinking is quite allien in Europe. I then started noticing my American friends saying "god bless" to me. They might have said this before, but I might just not have noticed this. It is quite unsettling. I mean, what do you reply. I don't want to be blessed. If you think blessing works then cursing does too. The worst thing is, religion seems to be on the winning hand in the US, at least in circles where it matters. I also cannot believe the incredible arrogance of thinking that god if any is on your side. Why would that be?? Any evidence of this??

03-03-2003, 07:44 PM	#3
Tercel Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: New Zealand Posts: 1,315	Yeah I'm constantly amazed by it also! There's something about Americans and religion which is just wacko.

03-03-2003, 10:09 PM	#4
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	Even with all those horrid "fundies" running around, with the gall to actually mention God, people bypassed Australia, France, Germany and England and came by the millions because A. It was started by "deists" who thought Jesus the greatest moral teacher in the world B. It is populated by people who actually follow the teachings of Jesus by, for example, feeding and rebuilding former enemy states. C. American soldiers actually read the Bible, and didn't rape their women D. They weren't looking for the socialists free lunch but preferred to earn their way among "fundies" E. There are no democratic Muslim nations F. They realized laws aren't much use without an internal policeman and knew the history of atheist states. G. All of the above Rad

03-03-2003, 10:19 PM	#5
Doubting Didymus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: East Coast. Australia. Posts: 5,455	Now if only any of those things were true.

03-04-2003, 01:54 AM	#6
Ganymede Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Auckland Posts: 58	Even with all those horrid "fundies" running around, with the gall to actually mention God, people bypassed Australia, France, Germany and England and came by the millions because A. It was started by "deists" who thought Jesus the greatest moral teacher in the world Care to cite some sources for this? B. It is populated by people who actually follow the teachings of Jesus by, for example, feeding and rebuilding former enemy states. Oh right! You mean like taking slaves, yes? C. American soldiers actually read the Bible, and didn't rape their women Shame that the bible is silent on the morality of rape. D. They weren't looking for the socialists free lunch but preferred to earn their way among "fundies" I think you will find that a very large proportion of American migrants arrived there before the advent of socialism (in around 1912?) E. There are no democratic Muslim nations Which has exactly nothing to do with the question. Besides which Malaysians would disagree with you. Ditto Indonesians. These might be young and some might say imperfect democracies but that's what they are. F. They realized laws aren't much use without an internal policeman and knew the history of atheist states. Which atheist states did you have in mind - none of the 4 you mention qualify. Not sure about Germany but France is Catholic and the UK and Australia both have the Queen as Head of State and she is also head of the C of E. No State / Church separation there. The US on the other hand constitutionally takes no position on the existence of God or shows any preference for any particular God. Depending on your definition of the terms, I guess that makes it either agnostic or atheist. G. All of the above As an example of reasoned response to a perfectly legitimate question this entire post rates an F. On the other hand, it's as good an example of xenophobic toy tossing as I have seen for a while. David.

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.