tronvillain

echidna:
Well, a hymen is not necessarily intact simply because it is a girl's "first time" and the "oops" thing can easily be avoided. Perhaps my first girlfriend and I were the exception to the "first time", but then we had six months of other activity before that Valentine's Day.

Primal

I actually think it's worse to not have sex before marriage, because you will always be wondering what someone else is like. This may cause one of the partners to cheat and/or feel cheated. Anyone jealous of someone the spuse slept with before the relationship has issues, the spouse is not a piece of property pre-ordained for anyone.

ohwilleke

Originally posted by Godless Dave:
<strong>Do you regret having sex before marriage, either with your current spouse or with other people? </strong> No.

<strong> Do you think you would be happier if you had only ever had sex with this one person? </strong> No.

<strong> Would it have been more special if you had waited until your wedding night to do it? </strong> No.

<strong> Do you feel jealous about the other people your spouse slept with before you were married to each other?</strong>

Interested, but not jealous.

Manta

No, times 4.

In some cases, I probably would have rethought any serious intentions of marital sex had things gotten more serious...

Boredom isn't fun. That deal about sex after marriage going away...no KIDDING in my case. But what the heck...it doesn't matter anymore...no more boredom...no more hubby.

-K "Playing around in left field"

ohwilleke

One of my favorite science fiction books had as one of its premises, that members of an alien species very similar to humans not only mate for life, but have males who kill everyone who every lived who previously or after the fact had sex with their mate (determined via a hyperaccute sense of smell).

The heroine was tricked into having sex with someone who was half-human and half-alien, before knowing about this behavoir or that her boyfriend was half-alien, and suddenly found her ex-boyfriends getting killed, and recognizing that anyone she ever had sex with in the future would be murdered by this man (who was very capable of carrying out his wishes despite her desires).

It was facinating to see her torn between choosing between loving and hating this man, recogning that he was only acting on a primal almost involuntary instinct, who was brutal towards men she slept with and yet utterly protective of her, and trying to save the lives of her lovers (since he was only half-alien and not entirely subject to this instinct).

Psycho Economist

To just generally reply (as i'm not married)... the minister probably has a point to a certain extent.

If you believe (or come to believe afterwards) that pre-marital sex is bad, m'kay... you'll feel guilty for having done it.

Likewise, if your spouse believes (or comes to believe after marriage) that it's immoral for you to have had sex before marriage, he or she will probably make you feel miserable, whether he or she means to or not.

Generally, though, people who would feel guilty about pre-marital sex aren't the ones who would do it... but it did probably make the middle-aged congregants who were libertine youths feel their stomachs drop. Probably not intentional, but good brainwashing never the less.

luvluv

Ironically, I kind of agree with all of you on most of your points. I don't expect my wife to be a saint or anything and I'm a firm believer in people having to sometimes go through some crap in order to become the people they need to be. So, regrets are wasted energy.

I would say though that waiting to my wedding night would make it more special. How could it not?

The only thing is, you folks need to be careful not to fall off the other side of the horse. Plenty of people DO make the decision to abstain from sex before marriage and it works just fine for them. It's a bit premature to call them repressed or liars. Can't we just let people be different? If you don't want them judging you, don't judge them.

I would also like to point out, statistically speaking, that married couples that have not slept or lived together before marriage have a markedly lower divorce rate than those that have. Actually, virgins who have not lived together have the lowest divorce rates, and the further you are away from this situation the higher the divorce rate.

I'll hunt the stats down, because I'm sure you'll make me, but I can't be the only one who's heard this?

[ October 16, 2002: Message edited by: luvluv ]</p>

luvluv

Okay I got this from this

site:http://www.rmfc.org/fs/fs0017.html

Which you obviously will question so I am trying to find the actual studies from the National Center for Health Statistics. Give me a minute.

In the meantime, read:

luvluv

Here's one about a study done by the Center for Disease Control.

<a href="http://vanderbiltowc.wellsource.com/dh/content.asp?ID=854" target="_blank">http://vanderbiltowc.wellsource.com/dh/content.asp?ID=854</a>

Psycho Economist

I hope i implied nothing of the sort, myself. I frequently channel Mr. Garrison when thinking about absolutist ethical systems.

I was trying to say that people who do abstain until marriage are also the ones who would feel the worst if they didn't. People who don't think it's wrong, don't act as if it is. Same goes, as I see it, for a lot of other things...

I'll stipulate that the correlation is valid; no need to go hunting for those numbers. What I would like you to think about next time such a study comes out is this (you probably won't find the answer in the popular press): refusal to engage in pre-marital sex is probably highly correlated with a an unwillingness to get a divorce generally. Were attitudes about divorce, and religiosity generally, statistically controlled for in these studies?

Also, divorce rate is not the end all / be all of marriage statistics. In general, I think our relatively high rate of divorce is nothing to be either ashamed or proud of... people are making the decision that they feel is most appropriate according to their own beliefs and circumstances.