Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 06-04-2010, 12:32 PM

This is a topic that comes up here with some frequency.

The DNA of Abraham's children

Quote:

Although the origin of the Jews has been traced, archeologically, to the Middle East in the second millennium B.C.E., what happened next has been more opaque. To sort it out, researchers collected DNA from Iranian, Iraqi, Syrian, and Ashkenazi Jews around New York City; Turkish Sephardic Jews in Seattle; Greek Sephardic Jews in Thessaloniki and Athens; and Italian Jews in Rome as part of the Jewish HapMap Project. (All four grandparents of each participant had to have come from the same community.) As the scientists will report in the next issue of the American Journal of Human Genetics, the analysis shows that “each of the Jewish populations formed its own distinctive cluster, indicating the shared ancestry and relative genetic isolation of the members of each of those groups.”

Jewish populations, that is, have retained their genetic coherence just as they have retained their cultural and religious traditions, despite migrations from the Middle East into Europe, North Africa, and beyond over the centuries, says geneticist Harry Ostrer of NYU Langone Medical Center, who led the study. Each Diaspora group has distinctive genetic features “representative of each group’s genetic history,” he says, but each also “shares a set of common genetic threads” dating back to their common origin in the Middle East. . . .

. . . Jews who migrated or were expelled from Palestine and from people who converted to Judaism during Hellenic times. During that period Jews proselytized with an effectiveness that would put today’s Mormons to shame: at the height of the Roman Empire, as the Roman historian Josephus chronicled, mass conversions produced 6 million practicing Jews, or 10 percent of the population of the Roman Empire. The conversions brought in DNA that had not been part of the original gene pool in the land of Abraham.

The DNA analysis undermines the claim that most of today’s Jews, particularly the Ashkenazi, are the direct lineal descendants of converted Khazars. . .. Instead, find the scientists, at most there was “limited admixture with local populations, including Khazars and Slavs ... during the 1,000-year (second millennium) history of the European Jews.”

Gawen · 06-05-2010, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

This is a topic that comes up here with some frequency.

The DNA of Abraham's children

Quote:

As the scientists will report in the next issue of the American Journal of Human Genetics, the analysis shows that “each of the Jewish populations formed its own distinctive cluster, indicating the shared ancestry and relative genetic isolation of the members of each of those groups.”

The DNA analysis undermines the claim that most of today’s Jews, particularly the Ashkenazi, are the direct lineal descendants of converted Khazars. . .. Instead, find the scientists, at most there was “limited admixture with local populations, including Khazars and Slavs ... during the 1,000-year (second millennium) history of the European Jews.”

I'm confused. Are Jews their own race or not?

arnoldo · 06-05-2010, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gawen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

This is a topic that comes up here with some frequency.

The DNA of Abraham's children

I'm confused. Are Jews their own race or not?

According to one of the links in the above article the Y chromosomes of Jewish priests confirms a common jewish ancestor approximately 3,000 years ago.

Quote:

According to biblical accounts, the Jewish priesthood began about 3,000 years ago when Moses anointed his older brother Aaron the first high priest. Ever since, the priestly status has been handed down from father to son through the ages.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/israel/familycohanim.html

Toto · 06-05-2010, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gawen

... Are Jews their own race or not?

Not distinct enough to be a separate race, even if you believe in the concept of race.

avi · 06-05-2010, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gawen

I'm confused. Are Jews their own race or not?

NOT. You have been reading too many Christian blurbs claiming that jews are god's chosen people.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBC summary

The study, published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, found that Jewish men shared a common set of genetic signatures with non-Jews from the Middle East, including Palestinians, Syrians, and Lebanese.

no. Jews share with other semitic peoples a common DNA heritage. This is the primary reason why it is so stupid for forum members to shout "anti-semitic" to someone who expresses hostility to hotbutton topics affecting jews.

A person can be ferociously hostile to judaism, and supportive of the Palestinian peoples' struggles against the zionist invasion, thus negating a claim of "antisemitism", since both groups are semitic peoples. DNA studies, such as the link above, confirm that jews and palestinians (formerly phoenicians) are cousins.

The really interesting question on this topic, in my view, relates to the African jews, both those with semitic DNA profiles, and those without, but with a strong bias favoring judaism. Historically, it is my impression, perhaps erroneous, that jews were VERY ACTIVE proselytizers. I understand, perhaps incorrectly, that jews invaded the horn of africa, from the Arabian peninsula, nearly three millenia before the present day, spreading moses' "laws", and his DNA. I wonder what happened to the indigenous males' DNA? Oh. yeah.

avi

Gawen · 06-19-2010, 04:19 PM

Thanks for the replies. I'm quite late and I apologise.

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06-19-2010, 04:19 PM	#6
Gawen Contributor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Cylon Occupied Texas, but a Michigander @ heart Posts: 10,326	Thanks for the replies. I'm quite late and I apologise.

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