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Old 10-29-2007, 02:48 AM   #131
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Magdlyn,

Did you realize that this link is edited by Roger Pearse? :huh:
As an aside: I think we're lucky to have Roger here. He brings in some good thoughts and very useful research, and he's always polite even when we skeptics give him a hard time.

Ray
You're very kind.

All the best,

Roger Pearse
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Old 10-29-2007, 06:55 AM   #132
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Actually I can tell you that text critics are deeply interested in who the scribe is, when we're dealing with renaissance copies of Greek texts.
Of course, they are interested in the scribe. I never thought otherwise. My point was that the quality of the scribe doesn't say anything about his religious bias or integrity.
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But of course as a rule we don't possess this information, for older mss. I'm a little nervous, tho, about this appeal to the 'rules of textual criticism'. These are aids, not rules, surely?
Rules, aids, guidelines, whatever. They are the things that one should sensibly consider and use to assign weight when attempting to evaluate variants. Older is frequently better, more difficult is more likely correct, and so. The rules currently widely accepted are the critical rules of Westcott & Hort, listed at the bottom of this page: http://www.bible-researcher.com/rules.html
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And don't these questions of yours apply equally to you?
Sure, but my opinion wasn't being solicited. I was trying to demonstrate issue that weren't being properly considered, IMHO. I wasn't looking to expound my own views.
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Are you sure that you want to commit to this proposition?
Orthography is, to my knowledge, a fair recent idea. If I am wrong, then by all means provide evidence to the contrary and I will gladly change my mind.
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Let's not use polysyllablic terms here, by the way -- I'm not certain what you're trying to say, and I don't want to guess.
Why just type words with one sound and not two or more? (Pretty cool, eh? A sentence of monosyllabic words.) Seriously, what is your complaint here? If you don't understand what I am trying to say then I probably didn't express myself clearly. I don't understand what the number of syllabes have to do with it.
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I can't tell if you're right, since, with 10 years interest in manuscript studies, I can't understand you. Try again in good English, please, and without the bogus Greek. ('periblepsical'?! Whatever does that mean?! And why say 'homoteleuton' rather than 'scribal eye skipping a line', unless we wish to intimidate rather than inform?)
In all fairness, periblepsis is more properly spelled 'parablepsis.' My bad. And, Roger, you are not only losing your manners here, you are not making much sense.

First of all, if you have issues with my English then maybe we should continue in Danish, my native language. No?

Secondly, when you call the terms 'bogus Greek,' it makes me wonder what it is you have been studying for 10 years. It is spelled 'homeoteleuton,' by the way, you missed the 'e'.

Thirdly, I am informing. See, I am here to learn and I assume that other people are, as well. Normally, 'homeoteleuton' and its counterpart 'homeoarchon' are normally abbreviated h.t. and h.a. I took the time to spell it out so that a reader could look it up for further information. In my approach, people learn a new term, can use it to find additional information, and uses the terminology generally used in the field, frequently without explanation or complete spelling. Does your idea contribute equally? Sorry, if you are intimidated, I didn't mean to scare you with my polysyllabic terms and 'bogus Greek.'
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Surely bad scholarship should be exposed? It isn't necessary to know lots of Latin to see if a scholar is pulling a fast one by the good old-fashioned methods of selection, omission and misrepresentation. The idea implicit in this (to my eyes) that people in the humanities should be above criticism by laymen seems curious to me, given the low reputation they enjoy for objectivity among scientists.
This seems non sequitur, errr, I mean, seems not to follow. Sometimes specialized knowledge is needed, and sometimes it isn't. And nobody is above criticism, nor anybody below stating it. I still don't see the relevance of this. Surely, on a discussion forum, one should critique the critique when such seems warranted, no?

Julian
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Old 10-29-2007, 07:37 AM   #133
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And why say 'homoteleuton' rather than 'scribal eye skipping a line', unless we wish to intimidate rather than inform?)
Ehrman, in the videos, if you'd bother to take a look, used the term for a laugh from his audience. He also said he always put it on his students' final exam, just to make sure they were paying attention in class.

There, 2 reasons to use a polysyllabic word!

Like Julian, I am scratching my head at your objection to that word, given your self ID as a maunscript studies expert.
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Old 10-29-2007, 07:46 AM   #134
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Actually I can tell you that text critics are deeply interested in who the scribe is, when we're dealing with renaissance copies of Greek texts.
Of course, they are interested in the scribe. I never thought otherwise. My point was that the quality of the scribe doesn't say anything about his religious bias or integrity. (etc)
Little in this seems to need a response from me. We can post to impress with jargon, or to inform. I prefer the latter.

All the best,

Roger Pearse
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Old 10-29-2007, 10:11 AM   #135
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We can post to impress with jargon, or to inform.
One can complain about the use of technical terms one doesn't understand or one can make an effort to improve one's vocabulary so that one might offer a substantive contribution.
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Old 11-01-2007, 12:31 PM   #136
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Little in this seems to need a response from me. We can post to impress with jargon, or to inform. I prefer the latter.
It does seem fair to note that Ehrman made use of both terms ("parablepsis" and "homeoteleuton," phew) in the videos and made something of a point of using them, too. To someone who watched the videos I don't see how use of either word could come off as showy in a thread about the same videos. I appreciate it when someone uses somewhat specialized jargon anyhow, especially in an informal setting, because then I look it up, link it to the material, and know what to look for when I'm browsing scholarly materials.

The most interesting thing that I heard was also the difficulty of translating some of the words of Jesus from Greek to Aramaic and vice versa. What I'm curious about is the strength of evidence that Jesus only spoke Aramaic, and if that argument is resolved not in favor, the likelihood that he would speak to two different people in two different languages.
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Old 11-01-2007, 02:37 PM   #137
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Let's not use polysyllablic terms here, by the way -- I'm not certain what you're trying to say, and I don't want to guess.
"Polysyllabic" is a polysyllabic term.
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Old 11-02-2007, 10:22 PM   #138
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As an aside: I think we're lucky to have Roger here. He brings in some good thoughts and very useful research, and he's always polite even when we skeptics give him a hard time.

Ray
You're very kind.

All the best,

Roger Pearse
I think he has stock in a company that spreads somthing-or-other on troubled waters. (BP?)
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