Toto

Jubilees online, courtesy of Peter Kirby's www.earlyjewishwritings.com .

Jackalope

I finally found what you were looking for. It's in Enoch. The story you're thinking of starts at Chapter 7. It starts with:

BuffaloBill

Thanks Jackalope,

Enoch won't do seeing it's not canon. I am debating a Christian who stated it was impossible for anyone to be thrown out of heaven. I was attempting to find a biblical scripture about my hunch that it was, but it appears to be futile.

Thanks to all.

Doctor X

Ah! Enoch interprets the passage of the bene elohim--"sons of gods"--mating with the women from Genesis.

However, it is the "angels" in Enoch rather than humans who "revolt." Anyways, people can reinterpret however they want.

--J.D.

Jeremy Pallant

Well, I don't recall such a passage in the Bible, but the concept can be found in Pilgrim's Progress by John Bunyan, which makes it at least 350 years old.

Paul5204

Doctor X:

In think that Maimonides would dispute your characterization of the adversary of Job fame. Please see his Guide for the Perplexed.

Wayne Delia

You got stomped in your post here by my response immediately following, when you tried to rely on Maimonides to resolve the "deadly trilemma" problem of 1 John 4:8, 1 Corinthians 13:4, and Exodus 20:5 combining to define the Judeo/Christian God out of logical existence. You haven't addressed any of my criticisms, which ended with the conclusion that perhaps you would be much better off not relying on Maimonides at all. Perhaps this is another standard loony Christian apologetic, "Argument from Maimonides," which refutes any Biblical criticism with "Maimonides would disagree!"

WMD

Doctor X

Irrelevant.

--J.D.

Tytummest

Revelation 20 speaks of the "devil or Satan" leading a revolt of "the nations". This is pretty much near the end of the Bible so perhaps this is the passage you are refering to.


REV 20:1 And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. 2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. 3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time

REV 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.


REV 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth--Gog and Magog--to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. 9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. 10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

rlcjhardesty

About Lucifer's fall from Heaven:

From Isaiah 14:
How you are fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How you are cut down to the ground, You who weakened the nations! For you have said in your heart: 'I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will also sit on the mount of the congregation On the farthest sides of the north; I will ascend above the heights of the clouds, I will be like the Most High.' Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol, To the lowest depths of the Pit. "Those who see you will gaze at you, And consider you, saying: 'Is this the man who made the earth tremble, Who shook kingdoms?

From Revelation 12:
Then there was war in heaven. Michael and the angels under his command fought the dragon and his angels. And the dragon lost the battle and was forced out of heaven. This great dragon – the ancient serpent called the Devil, or Satan, the one deceiving the whole world – was thrown down to the earth with all his angels.

Also from Revelation 12:
Rejoice, O heavens! And you who live in the heavens, rejoice! But terror will come on the earth and the sea. For the Devil has come down to you in great anger, and he knows that he has little time." And when the dragon realized that he had been thrown down to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the child.

From Revelation 20:
But fire from heaven came down on the attacking armies and consumed them. (clear indication that the coming rebellion will take place on earth - not in heaven)

About a Christian's security:

From John 10:
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand.