IamJoseph

I don't believe the Jews played any part in the Gospels, aside from those enforced to convert. My understading is this document was wholly devised outside of the middle-east by Romans and Greeks at a period much later than described, and there appears no proof to negate this.

IamJoseph

This is not correct. In Esau's time there was yet no religion or Hebrew laws written down, and all of the Hebrews married out. Esau commited many wrong deeds and was not interested in spirituality at all, while Jacob did - the reason their mother altered the status quo. Had it not been for Rebecca's far sighted vision, there would not have been any of the three middle-east religions today.

IamJoseph

He should have. Moses was a Messiah of his time, and no such excuses prevailed then.

The Hebrews in Moses' time were far worse.

The rule is to convince by example - not the rake or the sword.

They did. Whatever do you think Christianity and Islam are, and why is no one laying claim to Mecca or the Vatican!?

I never expected to impress you anyway - just to point out blatant historical falsehoods and absurdities which you must deny.

IamJoseph

So - you have not a shred of proof. No contemporary archives, relics or inter-nation disputation - aside from modern day scholars who also said David was a mythical figure? That's what I thought.

IamJoseph

Actually, I know of no scripture which displays the negative deeds of a people more so than the Hebrew bible does of the Jews. In fact every charge by the nations is lifted from the Hebrew bible. This is not a candy coated scripture for sure and can never be accused of pulling any punches.

Nor do I know of any other scripture which mandates to LOVE THE STRANGER and EQUAL JUSTICE FOR THE STRANGER AS THE INHABITANT. In fact both christianity and Islam display its antithesis. I am all ready to be corrected - so go ahead and make you day! :wave:

semiopen

We're not talking about David. We were discussing if the Pentateuch was written by Moses.

There is a consensus that David existed, although far from an overwhelming one. A mythical David was never a consensus view. The main issue with David is that Jerusalem does not appear to be a large enough village to be a capital of a kingdom until well into the so-called Divided Monarchy period.

There is certainly a complete absence of evidence that Moses wrote any of the Pentateuch. There is overwhelming evidence that it wasn't even begun until after the 11th century BCE.

hinduwoman

I hate (not) to rain on your parade, but the reason the scriptures display negative deeds of its people is that such deeds were not considered negative at the time scriptures were set down.
Slavery of people not belonging to Jewish tribes? It is natural.
Genocide of enemy tribes and rape of women? Why is it a problem, sp. if it gains you new rich territory?

That is why even in King James' time the translators did not have any problem with the more unpleasant aspects of the Bible --- what you call negative picture is negative only by our 21st century sissy standards.

You also don't seem to have read any Eastern scriptures at all.
Mahabharata for example does not pull any punches either and the real version is not for the faint of heart (unless of course mindless faith is engaged).
According to Hindu scriptures "This is my own and that a stranger’ – is the calculation of the narrow-minded
For the magnanimous-hearts however, the entire earth is but a family".

hinduwoman

To return to the OP,
Abrahamic religions are those who consider Abraham to be Very Important Person and the earliest of Prophets of their God.
Christians claim spiritual descent from Abraham, the first Patriarch to whom their God talked directly and promised to bless his children. It is this God who sent his Son to establish Christianity.
For Muslims the line is direct and genetic. According to their beliefs Abraham is the father of Ishmael who is the ancestor of arabs and directly of Muhammad. Abraham also built the kabbah.

IamJoseph

But is it also true? You have just disproven your own premise by showing how yours is the correct one. The fact is, life forms do have a need to have a home and a place to park their car, and that is why majestic laws have their place. Your premise has no relation to actuality in real space-time situations. Yes, this is my own - and you are a stranger. But you have not completed the sentence: one must respect the stranger, not lie to the stranger, not cheat the stranger - three mandated laws in the Hebrew. One must ask how you will react if your property was stolen?

IamJoseph

There is no evidence it was not written by Moses, or that anything therein was not contemporanous of its text descriptions. In fact, where 'evidence' is concerned [as opposed hard proof], there is greater evidence for Moses than David - or any figure of that period. David is a mere 250 years from Moses, and his writings, deeds, actions - mentions Moses numerously, and his writings allign with every part of the five books - with not a single error in its dates, names, events, geneologies and all other imprints and factors. Show us another more impressive evidence of any other figure in history?

I say, the Hebrew writings are the world's most honest, believable and proven writings humanity has in existence, and in every case where it was contradicted - the other party was wrong and/or false. Nothing else can compare with its veracity. This is not an opion but a fact.