Originally Posted by ralfellis

.
Water to Wine was a trick jug.

I think everyone is familiar with the 'water to wine' miracle, which is a central Catholic 'proof' that Jesus was divine. But strangely enough, we also know that this famous event was a trick, rather than a miracle. Indeed, we even know who made this trick jug, and we have the original 1st century design too. It was a trick jug made by Hero of Alexandria, the 1st century's Leonardo da Vinci:

http://himedo.net/TheHopkinThomasPro.../section8.html

And so sucessful was this 'water to wine' trick, in 1st century Near Eastern aristocratic circles, that Hero made about a dozen different design.


As Hero of Alexandria himself said of this trick:
"We may also pour in the water first, and then, stopping the vent, pour wine upon it, so as to pour out wine for some, wine and water for others, and mere water for those whom we wish to jest with."


Err, so this miracle was a jest, a joke, and the Catholic Church is effectively saying that David Copperfield and David Blaine are divine 'Sons of God', or something like that.

But I find this situation strange. We have known about Hero's trick jugs for centuries, so why has nobody before myself put forward the obvious deduction that Jesus himself was using one of these very same trick jugs? Ok, one can imagine the Catholics keeping it quiet, but what about all those 'honest' historians not tell us about this trick jug, that was used by the aristocracy and royalty of the Near East to entertain their guests? These are the aspects of this milennial deciet that I cannot understand.

So there we have it. It is more than likely that one of the central proofs of Jesus' divinity was based upon a 1st century party trick. However, this does also mean that the gospel records were based in part on real events, because the details are once more confirmed by history. It also implies that this gospel story was based upon royals or aristocrats, rather than pauper artisans - as I have long argued - for only the richest of families could employ David Copperfield or David Blaine to perform at their high-society wedding (at Cana, between Jesus and Mary Magdalene).


And again, I should point out that I am an Atheist searching for the historical truth, and not a believer shoring up a tottering belief system.

Ralph.

Originally Posted by ralfellis

.

Sorry, but everything is explainable.



Loaves and Fishes.
Bread... In Nazarene Judaism, 'bread' was often used to refer to knowledge. See Math 15:26. Jesus called this woman a dog because she was not Jewish nor Nazarene, and was not entitled to Nazarene wisdom. See also the discussion about 'leaven' (yeast), which even the disciples did not understand.

Fish... This is precessional astrology. In AD 10, the Precessional Age (Great Month) of Aries turned into Pisces. This is why Jesus was born as a Lamb of God (Aries) but became a Fisher of Men (Pisces). This is why the symbol of Christianity became the fish. This is why the pope wears the Fisher Ring. This is why Arthurian legend followed the line of Fisher Kings (as well as the Holy Grail).

Thus the Loaves and Fishes 'miracle' was simply a lecture about precessional astronomy - the Knowledge of the Precessional Age (the Great Month) of Pisces.




.

Originally Posted by ralfellis

But the water-to-wine miracle is one of the defining actions of Jesus that 'proves' he was semi-divine. It was HIS trick.

Or are you saying that the Catholic Church has got it all wrong, and it was the servants who poured out the wine who were the 'Sons of God'??


.

Originally Posted by Chili

The head waitress is the woman or greater serpent in the TOL here now herself come public to be among the guests who were present there.

To understand this first go to Gen. 3:15 wherein the chain of command runs from the woman in the TOL as greater serpent there, to Eve as the lesser serpent in the TOK who in her turn strikes at the heel of human as outsider to the TOL that they call Eden. Human here would be as in each one of us.

So here now, at the Royal Banquet that takes place inside the mind of man the lesser serpent there called Eve is eliminated, and so the chain of command is direct from the woman to Jesus as our insurrectionist, while we as the individual undergoer of this event are in a non-rational state of consciousness in this illumination scene by knowledge itself as the source from which she draws the primary premiss for all we do and what we are.

It so is an illumination event that provided the lineage in Luke after the HS entered him (and so not just shit on him) to make our own origin known of who exactly it is who we are and what we are all about.

It is also in this fashion that we enter the reign of God wherein we are up to 1000 year old, they say, and is why ancients came to be very old as reported in the OT someplace.

The transformation here has nothing to do with wine as wine is known to us, but in the transformation of our mind from the temporal blank slate [that we know] into the eternal soul or TOL over which the woman presided ever since we became a rational agent and took charge of our own life in the temporal TOK. In Buddhism this would be where the jump-shift form Yang to Yin is made, wherein also Arjuna said: I do not want your riches or your world, I want only you, and then Krishna made the jump-shift to be with her and left his own kingdom behind.

So it really is a home-coming celebration wherein our linege is revealed that on account of its transpersonal identity makes us eternal now, and hence the wine symbol is used to express that image here.

Intersting here is that this also makes the essence of bastard known with substance now as they will not be invited there. Hence some will be older than others here as that is where the incarnation from the father to the son is no longer trans-person-al.

To follow this you must realize first that the incarnation process in this lineage runs via the nucleus of the proton wherein life was first conceived, wherein so now also the 'first begotton son' is made known, and with a stranger in between is no longer tradition based, and hence the broken line.

To see this it helps to read the prayer of Zecharia in FULL assembly of Luke 1 "Announcement Birth of John" which truly is a Catholic event, that is tradition based and compare this with the total omission in Matthew where he was called 'out of Egypt' wherein John was like the bold appearance of camelhair coat (instead of Hebrew) in Mark, that makes religion shopping so popular these days.

Then it also helps to think metamorphosis here as that is what the Gospels are all about right from the start until the very end.

And welcome to FRDB where the argument continues without end, and it is good to see that you are a die-hard protestant who still hates the Catholic.

Originally Posted by Juma

What the beeeep is this shit? Word salad gone sour?

Originally Posted by Chili

Not to worry, I am used to that with more to follow.