Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 12-27-2006, 10:09 PM

http://www.cfiwest.org/calendar/RootsofAntisemitism.htm

Quote:

The roots of anti-Semitism run deep into the past, and find nourishment in the soils of both Christianity and Islam. Indeed, the Qur'an and the Bible have laid a foundation for centuries of persecution of Jews all over the world. From well before the Crusades to well after the Holocaust, these religions have themselves been instrumental in encouraging anti-Semitic attitudes and policies.

How can these texts which are considered by so many millions be the cause of so much bloodshed and injustice? What messages do these books send today?

Presenters include:

Paul Kurtz, Ph.D., father of secular humanism, founder of the Centers for Inquiry and author of many books on religion and ethics

R. Joseph Hoffmann, Ph.D., academic V.P. of the Center for Inquiry-Transnational and author of of Jesus Outside the Gospels (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Reuven Firestone, Ph.D., professor of Medieval Jewish History at Hebrew Union College, author of Jihad: The Origin of Holy War in Islam (or via: amazon.co.uk)

Eddie Tabash, J.D., human rights advocate, attorney, and Honorary Chair of the Center for Inquiry-West

S. Scott Bartchy, Ph.D., Director of the Center for the Study of Religion at UCLA

Carol Bakhos, Ph.D., Associate Professor of Late Antique Judaism and Jewish Studies, author of Ishmael on the Border: Rabbinic Portrayals of the First Arab (or via: amazon.co.uk).

Jack Miles, Ph.D., senior fellow, Getty Trust and Pulitzer prize-winning author; author of God: A Biography (or via: amazon.co.uk) and Christ: A Crisis in the Life of God (or via: amazon.co.uk)

judge · 12-28-2006, 03:42 AM

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Indeed, the Qur'an and the Bible have laid a foundation for centuries of persecution of Jews all over the world.

So...are they saying that the religious books of the jews themselves i.e. the Hebrew Bible, has laid a foundation for anti-semitism?

Or do they in fact only look at christianity and islam?

Quote:

The roots of anti-Semitism run deep into the past, and find nourishment in the soils of both Christianity and Islam.

Isn't it a little bit selective only look at christianity and islam?

The HB itself is full of the most preposterous stories about god and gods relationship to jews.
Could that in itself not be part of the problem?

Roger Pearse · 12-28-2006, 06:23 AM

Quote:

The roots of anti-Semitism run deep into the past, and find nourishment in the soils of both Christianity and Islam. Indeed, the Qur'an and the Bible have laid a foundation for centuries of persecution of Jews all over the world. From well before the Crusades to well after the Holocaust, these religions have themselves been instrumental in encouraging anti-Semitic attitudes and policies. How can these texts which are considered by so many millions be the cause of so much bloodshed and injustice? What messages do these books send today?

Am I right in thinking that the speakers are nearly all Jewish? If so, isn't this a conference by Jewish people, hurling accusations at non-Jews? If so, the unwisdom of such proceedings would seem to be very considerable.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

S.C.Carlson · 12-28-2006, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roger Pearse

Am I right in thinking that the speakers are nearly all Jewish? If so, isn't this a conference by Jewish people, hurling accusations at non-Jews? If so, the unwisdom of such proceedings would seem to be very considerable.

Paul Kurtz is a secular humanist (in fact, the secular humanist); his ethnic background is irrelevant.

dug_down_deep · 12-28-2006, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roger Pearse

Am I right in thinking that the speakers are nearly all Jewish? If so, isn't this a conference by Jewish people, hurling accusations at non-Jews? If so, the unwisdom of such proceedings would seem to be very considerable.

I don't understand. What are you saying?

It seems that you would have found it unwise of Frederick Douglass to speak out about slavery, if I read you right.

Toto · 12-28-2006, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roger Pearse

Am I right in thinking that the speakers are nearly all Jewish? If so, isn't this a conference by Jewish people, hurling accusations at non-Jews? If so, the unwisdom of such proceedings would seem to be very considerable.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Bartchy is a Christian. Kurtz, Hoffman, and Tabash are secular humanists; Eddie Tabash's mother was a Holocaust survivor and his father was a rabbi, but I have never heard him defend Judaism as a religion. I don't know about the others, but Firestone and Bakhos appear to be not totally unsympathetic to Islam, from the write-ups of their books.

I don't think that you should prejudge this as a group of Jews hurling accusations against non-Jews. This is a group of scholars with ecumenical and humanistic leanings, examining a real problem, and I expect that what they have to say will be worth hearing. I would not be surprised if one or more of the panelists presents the case that the texts are not inherently anti-semitic, but that anti-semitism has other roots.

My only concern is that an hour and a half is not enough time for all of these very learned and intelligent people to address the subject.

Roger Pearse · 12-28-2006, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

I don't think that you should prejudge this as a group of Jews hurling accusations against non-Jews.

I have no views either way; I merely saw what was reported, and asked the obvious question. But the rise in anti-semitism in our day is becoming precipitous -- it was hardly possible 20 years ago -- and anyone who is paying attention must see the seeds of the second holocaust taking shape even now. Nothing should be done which will encourage this trend.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

dug_down_deep · 12-28-2006, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roger Pearse

I have no views either way; I merely saw what was reported, and asked the obvious question. But the rise in anti-semitism in our day is becoming precipitous -- it was hardly possible 20 years ago -- and anyone who is paying attention must see the seeds of the second holocaust taking shape even now. Nothing should be done which will encourage this trend.

Nah. Bring it all out into the open. That's the only way to fight it. And if a new holocaust looms, arm the potential victims.

judge · 12-28-2006, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Eddie Tabash's mother was a Holocaust survivor and his father was a rabbi, but I have never heard him defend Judaism as a religion.

.

From his website...

Quote:

I only want to secure a society in which believers and non believers are equal before the law.

I can only say I fully support this sentiment, and whole heartedly look forward to the day when even the state of Israel supports such a sentiment as well.

I'm not being anti semitic in saying that am I? :devil1:

countjulian · 12-31-2006, 01:20 PM

Quote:

I can only say I fully support this sentiment, and whole heartedly look forward to the day when even the state of Israel supports such a sentiment as well.

If you're looking for Israel to officially share that sentiment, you day is come. You'll have to wait a while before you see the same thing happen in, say, Sudan, Iran, or Cuba or Vietnam for that matter.

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