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Old 05-12-2001, 04:22 PM   #1
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Question Was Methuselah a bad guy?

Here's an interesting tidbit that some may not know about:

By adding up the dates mentioned in the Bible, one discovers that Methuselah, Noah's grandfather and the oldest man to ever live (969 years), died in the same year as the flood. Also, Noah's father, Lamech, died about 5 years before the flood.

Offa actually got me to thinking about this when he posted a quote from Josephus' book The Antiquities of the Jews.

Ant. 1.3.4.(88) makes the following comment after talking about Methuselah, Lamech, and Noah:

These years, collected together, make up the sum before set down; but let no one inquire into the deaths of these men, for they extended their lives along together with their children and grandchildren; but let him have regard to their births only.

Could Josephus possibly be asking that "no one inquire into the deaths of these men" because of the appearance of when they died - 5 years before and during the year of the flood?

Has anyone ever read any commentary on this?

Ish
 
Old 05-12-2001, 07:13 PM   #2
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According to the Book of Jubilees several patriarchs
outlived the Flood. The trick was that 3 patriarchs got
100 years added to the begat dates of their sarcedotal son
in Genesis and this three hundred years resulted in their
deaths before the Flood.

Ish, thank you very much for at least spending some time
on what I write. I write my own stuff and I sure as hell
hate being portrayed as the "Grinch that stole Christmas".

thanks, Offa
 
Old 05-26-2001, 07:05 PM   #3
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according to Genesis
heir begat died d.o.d.
adam.......130.........0.......930.......930
seth.......105.......130.......912......1042
enosh.......90.......235.......905......1140
kenan.......70.......325.......910......1235
mahalalel...65.......395.......895......1290
jared*.....162.......460.......963......1423
enoch.......65.......622.......365.......987
methusela*.187.......687.......969......1656
lamech*....182.......874.......777......1651
noah.......600......1056.......950......2006
flood...............1656

*Notice how Genesis conveniently adds 100 years to the begat
dates of these patriarchs sons as opposed to Genesis. Also
Noah is a surprising 600 years old when his first son is
begat and this is 600 years before the Flood.

according to Jubilees (using a zero jubilee)
......................... Age when
............jub.date.....begat 1st...year.....lived....d.o.d.
adam.......jub00-7-7........130.......179.......930.......979
seth.......jub03-5-4........105.......284.......912......1091
enosh......jub05-6-4.........90.......374.......905......1189
kenan......jub07-5-3.........69.......443.......910......1284
mahalalel..jub07-5-3.........67.......510.......895......1338
jared......jub10-3-6.........61.......571.......963......1473
enoch......jub11-5-4.........65.......636.......365.......936
methuselah.jub12-7-6.........87.......723.......969......1605
lamech.....jub14-6-2.........33.......756.......777......1500
noah.......jub15-4-1........500+.....1258.......950......1706
flood*.....jub27-5-6.....................................1356

*According to Jubilees there are 4 patriarch's alive after
the Flood. Remember that Jubilees has been found nearly
intact with the Dead Scrolls and I am not so sure that we
have a prior identity to the Septuagint.

................................ Age when...year when
According.to.Josephus............begat 1st..begat 1st.lived.....died
adam...............................230......1230.. .....930......1930
seth...............................205......1435.. .....912......2142
enosh..............................190......1625.. .....905......2340
kenan..............................170......1795.. .....910......2535
mahalalel..........................165......1960.. .....895......2690
jared..............................162......2122.. .....963......2923
enoch..............................165......2287.. .....365......2487
methuselah.........................187......2474.. .....969......3256
lamech.............................182......2656.. .....777......3251
noah...............................600......3256.. .....950......3606
flood.............................2656


It kind of makes you wonder about Josephus' sources? Josephus adds
1000 years to the Genesis dates (See Antiquities Book 1 (82)). Also,
in Genesis and Josephus the Flood began during the Autumnal Equinox
whereas Jubilees has the Flood beginning on the 17th of the 2nd
month (Thu Apr 30, 1357). The curious note is that the Serpent had
conversation with Eve on the 17th of the 2nd month, i.e.,

Jubilees 03:17 And at the end of seven years which he completed
there, seven years exactly, in the second month on the
seventeenth day, the serpent came and drew near to the woman.


thanks, offa
 
 

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