outhouse

since when did theoogy turn into real history?

Tristan Scott

That hasn't been my experience.

Try an experiment Steve. Go to a bible study group at a local church and lay the Gilgamesh on them. The pastor will most likely politely ask you to come to his office and he'll inform you that it would be best, in the future, that you not attend.

Chili

Much like Catholics Jews will listen to the preacher and hear what he says, but likely will not take it to the bank and put their money on it. They will finally conclude that there is more to it than I/they know because both opposite parties cannot be right, and will just leave it at that.

Catholicsm has replaced the flood story with the Advent wreath to say the same thing, that points at Advent being a 'real life-time event' wherein our own life-houseboat is all that we are and all that we pretent to be, now looking for destiny here.

So it is not just a verbal question, but it says: "here I am, with not just my words" and there see a glimmer of hope waiting to bring new life about in the third 'white' candle on the wreath, this time, and that equals the dove Noah send out.

It is all allegory, including crucifixion, which must be true to even make it possible to be a real life time event, while churches are loaded and nobody knows what is going on in our very own life . . . and finally will be crucified by them too.

This is just a little more complicated than I just write here, but if it is possible that the grass can looking greener on some days than others, crucifixion is already possible too. And so now, the flood story is real, except that now the water was not wet but we were drenched in the storm of life that religion prepared us for by the very story as told.

The problem with this is that PhD's are like ass-wipe when this happens, and you can see here, time and time again, that they will always know best and are given the final word on what they call theology, which is a soft science at best wherein literacy counts by degree but metaphysics is not part as prior to physics and therefore will always be trump. And let's be reminded here that in Judaism the Torah of Tradition counts for the most as most effective in this (and so are already saying that 'theology' is a bullshit event as negative stand against which salvation must be found if we dare to say NO! much like Rouseau's Inquisitive Emile).

They call this induction, dear reader, wherein the intelligent design exists inside the species to make evolution possible, in which the TOK (or left brain) adds sense perception to the TOL so that it can 'be alive' as a living organism that is sensitive to local conditions and multiply with adaptation in mind.

It is basically very simple, but also true that there is no need to spend our entire life as oursider to us, and that is what metamorphosis is all about.

steve_bnk

Thanks. IMO good informative posts on Judaism.

steve_bnk

I'd like to hear what duvduv has to say without the usual sarcasm and banter.

Yes we on the secular side do not take any of it as literal, but there is no need to keep tossing that fact out.

Duvduv

Steve, could you be a bit more specific in terms of what you are asking about?
Thanks,
Duvduv

steve_bnk

While there may be references to actual places and events in the Torah that we can verify, us skeptics do not take it as literal. We categorically reject the supernatural parts.

Some on the forum will use any opening to proclaim that skepticism when a theists present theology,.

I'd rather see theists feel free to present their cases and beliefs without a continuous barrage of attempts to dispute and disprove by us sketics.

I am working a a thread on the implausibility o fThe Ark given the dimensions and what was sod to go on biard.

On that thread if you post your responses will be responded to critically with requests for something other than the Torah itself.

Duvduv

This is a huge area of inquiry. Events related to Torah stories are found in so many different sources I wouldn't know where to begin in terms of answering what it is you need to know. That's why I'd need you to be more specific. The book called Tikkunei Zohar, for example, is an entire text of discussions and exegesis on the first word of the Torah, "BERESHEET" ("In the beginning").

With regard to the Ark, sources explain that it was impossible for the dimensions specified in the Torah to house all the creatures that entered it (not to mention the requirement of the humans aboard to care for all of them). The Ark was what we today would describe as a structure that operated outside of our experience of three dimensional space. Indeed, there would have been no purpose at all for the Torah to bother describing the measurements of the ark at all if it were to house so many creatures. It would have sufficed to simply state that God commanded Noah to build something big which would house X number of creatures (not all creatures on earth necessarily).

As I mentioned, many sources explain that the Flood only occurred where there was human population, not in unpopulated areas, which would have meant that the animals found in many places did not have to come on board.

A similar description about time and space relates to the First Temple when so many people entered the Temple and felt no crowding at all.

I am not seeking approval of my explanation, but simply presenting it because you asked.

seyorni

Is no-one going to address the physical, meteorological or geologic problems with such a flood?

steve_bnk

Go right ahead