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04-03-2013, 07:37 PM
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#371 | ||||||||
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Here is an extract from Where did Christianity get the idea of demons ? Quote:
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This page goes on to outline uses of the term by the pagans and Christians ... Quote:
εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia |
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04-03-2013, 07:47 PM
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#372 | |||||||||
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Here's a list of the use by 3rd-5th century pagan and Christian authors of the nominative singular of δαίμων and of δαιμόνιον. Can you state categorically, Pete, that the meaning that these words have in these instances -- or even just in the ones from Christian authors -- is always (invariably) "evil spirit"? Search for: daimwn Quote:
Jeffrey |
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04-03-2013, 07:56 PM
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#373 | |||
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Of course Jeffrey I cannot say that I know. But I am prepared to investigate the matter. Thanks for this most interesting survey .... Quote:
Some preliminary comments: (1) It would seem that a study of Plutarch's use of the term would be a good idea considering his extensive use. There are a number of articles that I have found in this regard, which I will read with interest in the next few days. (2) Where precisely does your survey finish chronologically? I can see that Philostratus is mentioned but there seems to be the omission of Plotinus. If you recall, I think that the full survey should be extended to the end of the 4th century at which time we have for the first time a NT canon, despite the changes between (say) 4th century Greek bible codices (such as Vaticanus) and the Greek TR used by the translators of the KJV. Here is a very interesting article ON THE DEMONOLOGY OF PLOTINUS Quote:
Thanks again for this survey Jeffrey. εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia |
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04-03-2013, 08:23 PM
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#374 | |||||||
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Jeffrey |
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04-03-2013, 08:26 PM
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#375 | ||||
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Young's Literal TranslationThe term in question is Xenōn daimoniōn Ξένων δαιμονίων Of foreign gods I'm not sure how this helps your case. It looks like you have found a positive or neutral use of the term daimon in Christian literature. Or how this helps it: Quote:
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04-03-2013, 10:09 PM
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#376 | |||
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I have stated again and again, for the purpose of investigating the fate of the Greek "daimon" in antiquity, in this thread I am happy to run with the mainstream hypothesis that the authorship of the canonical new testament was a phenomenom of the first and possibly second centuries of the common era. Most people accept this hypothesis. A number of key resources support the claim that there was a shift in the meaning of "daimon" in the common era. However I actually appreciate what you have set out to do, which is to momentarily disregard the summary positions and plunge into the detailed citations which underpin the summary. (BTW what I mean by summaries are the LJS entry for δαίμων and the Dictionary of Deities and Demons in the Bible. We even see in the Theological Dictionary of the New Testament .... Quote:
εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia |
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04-03-2013, 10:27 PM
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#377 | |||||
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As advised above, I have obviously relied upon summaries (3 examples provided). Quote:
The TLG is certainly an impressive database. Thanks for the following .... Quote:
NO. Of course I cannot without weeks or months of work which, whether or not it means anything to you, I am prepared to do. A proper study of the claim made in the OP would benefit from such a comprehensive review. I have not used the TLG database software. Does it include references from these instances to English translations? I'd imagine this would be a manual step. Quote:
An amazing list. Thanks. εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia |
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04-03-2013, 10:33 PM
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#378 | ||
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Christian demonising of daimons was central to their argument that pagan religion was false. Pre-Christian daimons need adjectives to show their moral standing. New Testament daimons don't need adjectives to show their moral standing. I suspect there are some exceptions involving later archaic Christian use of daimon in the Greek sense, but this change in meaning is the general rule. |
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04-03-2013, 10:43 PM
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#379 | ||||||
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Like the other 99.99% of people on this planet who do not read Greek I shall be forced to rely on examining multiple English translations in the pubic domain. I suppose another option is to learn Greek. I have entertained the idea. It should not be an impossible task in this age of the internet, but to be realistic I probably cant afford the time. Quote:
Fair enough. It would not then include "Vita Apollonius". I see. Thanks Quote:
Thanks for the confirmation. BTW is it possible for me to generate these lists if I subscribe or register with TLG or are these reports only available directly to students and teachers? εὐδαιμονία | eudaimonia |
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04-04-2013, 06:13 AM
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#380 | |
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And no -- there are no references there to English translations. Jeffrey |
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