Adam

It never ended.

Sheshbazzar

Just to be clear Adam, are you stating that it never ended for the original 1st century disciples ?
or is it you are claiming that The Holy Spirit is still what is guiding christians today ?

Adam

Had you asked about "apostles", I would have clarified that charismatic gifts have never ceased, but I took your question about "disciples" to include Christians throughout the ages. Your #72 makes a false dichotomy additional complication. Though I believe that "being filled with the spirit" has never ceased, that does not mean that all Christians receive it nor even that those who have it are primarily guided by it. We humans are very imperfect Creatures. Look at how many supposedly loving Christians are voting for Romney because they hate Black people more than they hate Mormons. Of course, few Christians take the gospels seriously, they prefer Paul, so voting for Romney does not seem like an obvious contradiction to them. They don't take Jesus seriously about rich people.

Sheshbazzar

Interesting. So The Son of Man erred in making His statement in Luke 11:9-13 ?

Am I to understand by this that you also reject Peter's statement in Acts 2:38-39 ?

Is it also your opinion that 1 Thess 4:1-8 was only for 'Apostles' and not for all 'disciples' in all times ?


I used 'disciples' in the same inclusive sense that it is used in Acts 13:52, ALL that were 'disciples' were filled with The Holy Spirit.




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Adam

I think my Post #73 made it pretty clear that those kinds of questions are not relevant to me. I don't accept plenary inspiration nor literal inerrancy, much less the universal application you seem to insist for every verse. That's why getting a more authentic approach to what Jesus said is so important to me, as against what early Christians thought.

Sheshbazzar

So your 'form' of 'christian' faith is at considerable variance to that described in the NT.

What the apostles and disciples of the first centuries may have believed or taught is entirely secondary to whatever theory Adam cooks up.

I haven't anywhere insisted on any universal application of every verse. Above I specifically limited the questions to the three above given texts;
Luke 11:9-13, Acts 2:38-39 and 1 Thess 4:1-8.
which it is up to you to somehow demonstrate are not acceptable texts, nor were intended to be of any universal application.

But well enough that you dodge, as I only needed you to establish, in your own words, that you consider your personal persuasions and textual meddling to be greater in value than the testimony of Jesus, the Apostles, and to that Holy Spirit given testimony that these texts have for so long conveyed to mankind.

I have taken the time to carefully search through every post that you have ever made in these Forums. And a rather strange anomaly appeared.
It is noteworthy that you have quoted huge blocks of NT texts, many times more texts than any other person participating in these threads, and yet for all of that you have somehow managed to never once mention The Holy Spirit.
Which in and of itself would not be remarkable, if it were not for the fact that almost every other poster regularly participating in these same threads has mentioned the Holy Spirit on multiple occasions, some dozens of times.
In view of this, one would not be out of line in noting that 'The Holy Spirit' does not get much play nor credit at all in your self-important and self-promoting 'form' of Adam religion.

You are willing to make liars out of even Jesus, the Apostles, and the very words given to mankind under the guidance of The Holy Spirit, if so doing will give a patina of support or legitimacy to your hacking up, and cutting and pasting of the NT texts.

Pathetic. And very evident that you have no love in your heart for The Son of Man, nor respect for The Holy Spirit, nor the words given by the early disciples and the Apostles whom testified of their beliefs.
All you do is mutilate their testimonies to make yourself appear to be something.
I'd say you are succeeding quite well in that task, as you certainly do appear to be something. Something slimy and slithery that hides under a rock.



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Adam

Poor Shesh--
I didn't fit into quite the trap he had dug for me. Confessing myselfr to be a Charismatic Christian, he paradoxically faults me for not featuring verses about the Holy Spirit. Apparently I have been too even-handed to present "many times more text than anyone else" that allows so much for HJ knowledge about Jesus.

Or the trick (Halloween?) was just to keep me diverted so I wouldn't post more text?

Sheshbazzar

Post as much of your textual chop-suey as you want, (<edit> None of it, nor anything you have ever posted concerning it, has thus far proven that any of it ever originated with any eyewitnesses, and no matter how much more of these mutilated texts you may get away with posting, never will.

As far as the trap, it suffices me for the time to demonstrate by the actual content of these Early christian texts, that you do not fit their descriptions of what constitutes a christian, nor hold basic christian held beliefs.
Thus you are NOT safely on that ancient and textually supported base.
You have departed in your reasonings from "The Faith which was once delivered unto the saints." (Jude 3) Jude 4 therefore describes you and your present activities.
As per Jude 16, You hold Teeple and similar apostates in admiration while despising and discounting the very texts, because to do so is to your self-aggrandizing advantage.

You are right here and now caught 'off base', being in all fact NOT a christian, not holding fast nor 'contending' for those basic christian beliefs "once delivered unto the saints" as presented in the NT.

Your claimed 'christianity' is therefore nothing more than a outright sham, Nothing more than a name that you steal and abuse as a disguise and deception employed to promote your own vanity and self interests.

Sheshbazzar

Old Adam is NOT really a 'Christian', but just a manifestation of a very old and very slimy snake.





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Duke Leto

Hammertime?