Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jolimont · 03-17-2003, 03:42 PM

I watched Dean on the video and loved it. Please, let this man get nominated and give dubya a run for his money!!!

Mr. Superbad · 03-17-2003, 04:03 PM

Howard Dean says he will back troops, but not war policies

Quote:

Former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean said Monday war with Iraq will not silence his outspoken criticism of the presidential policies that led to it.

"It is our patriotic duty to say to the president, 'We wish our troops well. We hope they get home safely and soon, but Mr. President, we think this war is a mistake,'" Dean told a gathering of Democrats.

"This is the wrong war at the wrong time," said Dean to loud cheers and waves of applause from the 300 people who came a luncheon to meet the presidential candidate.

Dean's campaign has been gathering energy, money and supporters in part because of his outspoken criticism of George W. Bush's push for war with Iraq. He said the outbreak of war will not stop that criticism.

"I will support the troops," he said, mentioning a January lunch he had with Marines stationed at Parris Island in South Carolina.

"I went to Parris Island so I could look into the faces of the kids who will be sent to Iraq," he said. "We should always support our kids, but I do not support this president's policies and I will continue to say so."

...

Dean said he believed his campaign was catching on because "people desperately want someone to stand up for American values.

"They are tired of being told by the right-wing talk show hosts and fundamental preachers how to lead their lives. They desperately want their country back.

"We are going to take this country back."

Grumpy · 03-17-2003, 04:23 PM

Apparently, the major disqualifying factor for Dean (issues aside) is his lack of a national profile. This is building among the more savvy, but you really need a name-brand candidate to connect with the proles (if you'll pardon the expression).

Name recognition aside, here's a hypothetical Dem ticket for 2004: Howard Dean / Gen. Wesley Clark. Can a pair of dark horses topple the Boy King? Depends on how the war goes, I guess.

Jolimont · 03-17-2003, 04:28 PM

I'd rather see a woman or a minority on the ticket. Enough with the white men already!

ex-idaho · 03-17-2003, 04:34 PM

No matter who the presidential nominee is for the Dems the VP is going to be a southerner. I expect Kerrey/Edwards or possibbly Dean/Edwards if he continues to broaden his appeal and get the favorable media attention that he has to this point.

marylandnaturegirl · 03-17-2003, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Grumpy
Apparently, the major disqualifying factor for Dean (issues aside) is his lack of a national profile. This is building among the more savvy, but you really need a name-brand candidate to connect with the proles (if you'll pardon the expression).

Name recognition aside, here's a hypothetical Dem ticket for 2004: Howard Dean / Gen. Wesley Clark. Can a pair of dark horses topple the Boy King? Depends on how the war goes, I guess.

So far, Dean has built much more of a National profile than a little known Gov. Bill Clinton had before the 92 Dem primaries.

if you check out the Dean 2004 meetup.com Dean has more people signed up for Dean meetups than ALL the other presidential candidates combined!

People are coming out in droves for him around the country.

see http://www.dean2004.meetup.com

( while you are there don't forget to check out
http://www.atheists.meetup.com and http://www.skeptics.meetup.com )

marylandnaturegirl · 03-17-2003, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ex-idaho
No matter who the presidential nominee is for the Dems the VP is going to be a southerner. I expect Kerrey/Edwards or possibbly Dean/Edwards if he continues to broaden his appeal and get the favorable media attention that he has to this point.

While personally, I am against Dem candidates taking pot shots at eachother or infighting too much (I'd rather see them just put themselves and their policies out there because I think it comes back to haunt them when they bash eachother, because then the republicans pick up the same stuff when it comes time for the general ecletion), however...

from what I have heard Dean has already been harshly criticizing Edwards, and if that keeps up I can't imagine him then turning around and wanting him as a running mate or vice versa.

You never know though.

clark · 03-18-2003, 02:29 AM

Wow! That speech was great! I'd love a .wav or .mp3 file just of where he says "I'm tired of being divided! I don't want to listen to the fundamentalist preachers anymore!" I didn't expect a major political candidate to say something like that, and was especially pleased that this statement garnered more applause than anything else he said. I made a contribution to his campaign after hearing it. I agree with most of what he says, as a social liberal, fiscal moderate.

The most important thing, of course, is can he beat Bush? I kind of hope that he does the opposite of Nixon's advice to Poppy Bush - campaign liberal to win the Democratic nomination and shift more centrist to win the White House. He has less name recognition than most of the other candidates, but a lot less "baggage". His record in Vermont is impressive, but Vermont is the second smallest US state, and not exactly representative of the US, as it has no large cities.

His primary issue appears to be universal health care (aside from Iraq, which should be a moot issue by the time the election rolls around). If he, as a physician, can sell it and separate it from Hillary's failed proposal during the Clinton administration, it may be a winning, populist issue.

THOUGHTfully Yours,
Clark

Ut · 03-18-2003, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ex-idaho
No matter who the presidential nominee is for the Dems the VP is going to be a southerner. I expect Kerrey/Edwards or possibbly Dean/Edwards if he continues to broaden his appeal and get the favorable media attention that he has to this point.

What is it with Southerners? When the Clinton/Gore ticket won two times in a row, nobody complained that there were no Northerners on the ticket. (Clinton from Arkansas and Gore from Tennessee)

clark · 03-18-2003, 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ut
What is it with Southerners? When the Clinton/Gore ticket won two times in a row, nobody complained that there were no Northerners on the ticket. (Clinton from Arkansas and Gore from Tennessee)

That was the brilliance of that ticket. The South leans right, yet both on the ticket were Southerners. New York, New England and California would have voted Democratic anyway. Clinton/Gore had a built-in regional advantage. This also makes it hard for non-Southern democrats to fare well in national elections (Lieberman, Dukakis, Mondale, etc.). The two most recent Democratic presidents have been Southerners. This also may give Edwards and Graham somewhat of an advantage.

THOUGHTfully Yours,
Clark

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03-17-2003, 03:42 PM	#21
Jolimont Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USA expat, now living in France Posts: 1,153	I watched Dean on the video and loved it. Please, let this man get nominated and give dubya a run for his money!!!

03-17-2003, 04:23 PM	#23
Grumpy Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Alaska, USA Posts: 1,535	Apparently, the major disqualifying factor for Dean (issues aside) is his lack of a national profile. This is building among the more savvy, but you really need a name-brand candidate to connect with the proles (if you'll pardon the expression). Name recognition aside, here's a hypothetical Dem ticket for 2004: Howard Dean / Gen. Wesley Clark. Can a pair of dark horses topple the Boy King? Depends on how the war goes, I guess.

03-17-2003, 04:28 PM	#24
Jolimont Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USA expat, now living in France Posts: 1,153	I'd rather see a woman or a minority on the ticket. Enough with the white men already!

03-17-2003, 04:34 PM	#25
ex-idaho Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Spudtopia, ID Posts: 5,315	No matter who the presidential nominee is for the Dems the VP is going to be a southerner. I expect Kerrey/Edwards or possibbly Dean/Edwards if he continues to broaden his appeal and get the favorable media attention that he has to this point.

03-18-2003, 02:29 AM	#28
clark Beloved Deceased Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Sin City, NV, USA Posts: 3,715	Wow! That speech was great! I'd love a .wav or .mp3 file just of where he says "I'm tired of being divided! I don't want to listen to the fundamentalist preachers anymore!" I didn't expect a major political candidate to say something like that, and was especially pleased that this statement garnered more applause than anything else he said. I made a contribution to his campaign after hearing it. I agree with most of what he says, as a social liberal, fiscal moderate. The most important thing, of course, is can he beat Bush? I kind of hope that he does the opposite of Nixon's advice to Poppy Bush - campaign liberal to win the Democratic nomination and shift more centrist to win the White House. He has less name recognition than most of the other candidates, but a lot less "baggage". His record in Vermont is impressive, but Vermont is the second smallest US state, and not exactly representative of the US, as it has no large cities. His primary issue appears to be universal health care (aside from Iraq, which should be a moot issue by the time the election rolls around). If he, as a physician, can sell it and separate it from Hillary's failed proposal during the Clinton administration, it may be a winning, populist issue. THOUGHTfully Yours, Clark

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