Aquila ka Hecate

Yo!

Scary rituals indeed!

That was an appropriate link you posted, Heathen dawn, considering that I was initiated into a Gardnerian coven.

However, I have found it not only possible, but, in light of my rote-memory of the words, necessary, to rewrite those exact same rituals for a secular pagan.

I still celebrate the eight sabbats, with celebrate being the operative word. (It's Ostara I've just finished).

The casting of the circle, traditionally done by the priestess, was one of the toughest to reword.
But I managed it- it's now a symbolic 'nest' for meditation on life.
Instead of blessing and exorcising the salt and water, i take time to cherish these representatives of what makes life possible.

And you should just hear my version of the charge of the goddess!Not a g-word in sight.

The quarters have lost their mystical gaurdian status and metamorphosed into electromagneticism, strong nuclear force, weak nuclear force, and gravity.(North is our 'fire' direction down here).

And I freely admit a prediliction for waving an edged weapon around.

Sigh. There's still nothing quite as life-affirming as building a nice big bonfire and leaping over it with your partner.

The neopagan religions aren't all that bad a vehicle for secularism, after all, after a good working-over.The main problem, I repeat, tends to be the practitioners themselves, most of whom seem to go with Cunningham and the nature-based religion thing publicly, but who seem to harbour longings for a mystery religion of the most extreme example.

They're not so far removed from the monotheists, after all. Many seem to have taken the omnipotent god thing, replaced it with omnipotent god/esses thingies,and thrown in a whole heap of baggage, including invocations, evocations, elementals, reincarnation etc etc.

Which is just the kind of stuff I am unable to accept-in wicca as much as in christianity.

Beleive it or not, most of my former coreligionists were as horrified by the 'A'-word as any church deacon.A lack of beleif in any gods was totally bewildering and unnacceptable to many of them.

brighid

Heathen Dawn,

In my profile you will see I am an atheist/pagan ritualistic. I participate regularly in a “coven” of sorts, and I am even on the priestess track. I do not believe in magick, Gods, Goddesses, fairies or what not … but I do thoroughly enjoy the rituals of my group. I missed Mabon with the girls because I had an awful head cold coming on. Anyway, paganism does not require a dogmatic view or relationship. It is creative, flowing and adaptive. You can make Wicca whatever you desire it to be, even if Cunningham tells you differently. He is a good source, but NO ONE is the end all and be all of Wiccan practice, knowledge or ritual.

I have read relatively few books and all ritual I participate in I do so instinctively. I have cast the circle for my group more then once and in those times I create a special casting and opening in a poetic manner. It is used for visualization and meditation more then anything else.

I like Aqua’s description of where she is now. I guess I too am a secular pagan of sorts. At least 3 women in our group are atheist and others are theists of varying degrees. The Crone comes from an atheist/Protestant background, the majority from Polish and Italian Roman Catholic backgrounds, and another from a secular/Jewish background. Each of us views circle and the Gods and Goddesses in a different way. They are aware that I am an atheist, as is the Crone and one other member. There are no problems. My group is unique and there certainly are pagans that find the “A” word to be icky. But I certainly find more acceptance and freedom amongst atheists and pagans then I do amongst other religious and non-religious groups.

I am not the “fluffy” variety of Wiccan/Witch and I understand the draw to that, but I don’t find it realistic within the real world. I think it is an excellent principle to strive toward, but I can think of instances in where harm will come to things or persons (such as in self-defense.)

Find what works for you and if nothing works for you REMAKE it to work for you. I struggled for a while with my group when I really began to embrace atheism. I didn’t attend for a while because I didn’t feel I could, but I discussed it with the Crone and discovered she was also an atheist and there would be NO problem in my participation.

Circle is meditative and comforting. I trust the women in my group and I care deeply about them. I would be devastated to loose their friendships, whereas I would not be with others. I find Circle to be supportive and comforting in ways other relationships aren’t or can’t be. As a woman, it is a place where I can celebrate my femininity and where it is a strength, not a weakness. It is a place where I can spend time visualizing my hopes and dreams and be amongst those who support that vision. With work, family, home life and caring for everyone I don’t always have much time for myself. This is sort of an indulgence and I enjoy it, without delusions of super-natural deities, or beings.

Brighid

Rusting Car Bumper

I suggest this ritual.

You will need:
A nice comfortable chair.
A nice big bag of tea.
A small pot.
Stove.
Some books of great importance to humans with emphasis on non-fiction.

Directions:
Get pot, stove and tea and brew it as per any instructions.
After the tea is brewed, sit in chair.
Read said book, while sipping said tea for 1 to 2 hours.

Pick a time of the week to perform the ritual. Commit to this time EVERY week. When you finish a book start a new one.

Benefits: Your mind will become your own religion, superstition may be vanquished, and all other "ritual" and "earth centered" religions will look like Bugs Bunny cartoons in comparison.

DC

Panta Pei

Zen master DC is also correct, Heathen Dawn, unless you favor coffee over tea and would rather watch a sunset than fill your head with more words from others.

Yet still, it has been my experience that Bugs Bunny will also teach you much about life, the universe and everything.

"Whoever says he knows the way, does not know the way."

Heathen Dawn

I don't like tea. I prefer coffee. And I like watching the sunrise.

All this stuff about initiation reminds me of Star Wars: one with the Force, Jedi Master, you have much to learn, stepping into a larger world and so on. I don't want to be initiated into mysteries, I prefer to be a secular pagan - where Nature alone is the whole mystery, and open to anyone who seeks.

"The name that can be named is not the eternal name" - Tao Te Ching

Cipher Girl

HD are you looking for a teacher to follow or are you looking to find a path for yourself? I think that nowdays Wicca is starting to become more mainstream. Here in Lancaster, CA the local pagan group advertises their meetings in the religion section of the paper. But last summer a group of christians harassed them at one of thier meetings. But what was amazing, was the fact the local paper published shitloads of letters critisizing the fundys. It made the fundys look like a bunch of klan members.

Speaking of finding a teacher for a path puts me in mind of my favorite zen koan:
"Meeting a zen mater on the road, face him with neither words or silence. Give him a kick in the ass and you will be called one who follows zen."

I love all of the meanings in this koan.

Good luck with your search.

Rusting Car Bumper

And to learn nature one learns science. As of yet there is no better description or way to get into it.

DC

Heathen Dawn

Science is dead boring.

lpetrich

I don't find that to be the case.

But that could just be me.

JP2

Nature doesn't need to be mystified or shrouded in spirituality to inspire reverential awe. It speaks loudly enough for itself.

My advice would be to disregard whatever systems of spirituality that are offered by such Wiccan religions and discover nature on your own terms, without unnecessarily blinding yourself to its true nature by adopting any system of spirituality that has a name.

If, as you said earlier, you are genuine in wishing to avoid any "mystery religion of initiation into supernatural secrets", then I might suggest you seriously ponder why you are considering joining what can only be described as a "religion" (atheistic or not) that - to the best of my knowledge - is high on the concept of supernaturalism? What can Wicca offer you that a more private, autonomous system of naturalistic reverence cannot?

Or am I just an ignorant thug, beating up on religions that I do not understand?