Darth Dane

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. The fact that some people "adamantly claim" something has absolutely no bearing regarding the truth of the claim.

Correct, so what are we left with? That we cannot talk about anything that sin't real or hasn't been observed. It doesn't mean it can't happen in teh future, it just means it doesn't happen now.

So any claim that says that God is or that God is not, will eb out i the same thing really.


I can adamantly claim that gravity stopped working, but if I jump off a building I'll still fall at 9.81 m/s/s.

You mosy likely will, although I have heard tales that humans can fly without aid, of course I haven't sen it, but it imght be possible, I know so precious little of teh world at large, but of course some say that after 1 million experiments then it is certain that it can't be done, empirical data or some sort. Alas we cannot make all the attempts because we can keep on trying as long as we exist...indefinately

quote:
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Originally posted by Keith Russell
darth, if you were alone in the woods, and a spaceship landed nearby, and the extraterrestrials took you on board, and told you everything about their homeworld, culture, language, etc., then let you go--
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If? Don't you mean again?


:notworthy

LOL nice ones

Keith Russel, imagine that Jesus had a similar experience, but he just had to say what he saw and witnessed, much to the chagrin of the priests then. And look it has shaped life until now

Yeah maybe I was abducted....





DD - Cheers Spliff

Keith Russell

Darth, rational persons do not accept claims (even conditionally) without evidence.

If you have had an extraordinary experience, but there is no evidence that you can show to someone else to support your claim that the experience was 'real', again, I can only advise you to keep such an experience to yourself.

Those who claim the existence of Jesus, 'God', miracles, angels, demons, ghosts, etc., can thank the fact that there are so few rational people.

K

Darth Dane

Darth, rational persons do not accept claims (even conditionally) without evidence.

True, neither would I.

If you have had an extraordinary experience, but there is no evidence that you can show to someone else to support your claim that the experience was 'real', again, I can only advise you to keep such an experience to yourself.

Yes, however I have met numerous persons, who all confirmed that Aura's do exist, they have seen it, and I have seen it.
The evidence comes from other persons experiences, they confirm my experience even though we cannot really compare the two, except to say that it surrounds our body.

Those who claim the existence of Jesus, 'God', miracles, angels, demons, ghosts, etc., can thank the fact that there are so few rational people.

I don't claim that God Is or Jesus Is, or aura's Is, I have experienced aura's, does that definately tell me it is true? No, of course not, scientists says it is hallucinations by teh brain, others that teh spirtual side is partly open to me.

And when you start finding humans who have had similar experiences you affirm your experience with eachother, just like any other club you wanna join.





DD - Love Spliff

John Page

Two minds with but a single (non-identical but functionally equivalent) thought!

Cheers, John

Keith Russell

Keith: Darth, rational persons do not accept claims (even conditionally) without evidence.

Darth: True, neither would I.

K: If you have had an extraordinary experience, but there is no evidence that you can show to someone else to support your claim that the experience was 'real', again, I can only advise you to keep such an experience to yourself.

D: Yes, however I have met numerous persons, who all confirmed that Aura's do exist, they have seen it, and I have seen it.

K: But, they didn't confirm it, Darth. They only claimed it. Humans only ever make claims. You want confirmation, you have to go to reality. Seeking more claims confirms nothing. As one can err, so can many.

D: The evidence comes from other persons experiences--

K: Sorry. The fact that other people claim to have had certain experiences is, is not evidence in any sense.

D: --they confirm my experience even though we cannot really compare the two, except to say that it surrounds our body.

K: So, if I can get twenty or thirty virgins (yeah, I know, if I can find any) to explain to you that unicorns exist, and that only virgins can perceive unicorns, and if they tell you that they have in fact seen unicorns, will you then choose to believe in unicorns? If I offer you nothing other than these young womens' claims, will you then claim that their 'experiences' are 'evidence' or 'confirmation' of the existence of unicorns?

K, earlier: Those who claim the existence of Jesus, 'God', miracles, angels, demons, ghosts, etc., can thank the fact that there are so few rational people.

D: I don't claim that God Is or Jesus Is, or aura's Is, I have experienced aura's, does that definately tell me it is true? No, of course not, scientists says it is hallucinations by teh brain, others that teh spirtual side is partly open to me.

And when you start finding humans who have had similar experiences you affirm your experience with eachother, just like any other club you wanna join.

K: No apologies. I choose to stick to reality to tell me what is true, not clubs, cliques, cults...or religions.

K

Darth Dane

Keith: But, they didn't confirm it, Darth. They only claimed it. Humans only ever make claims. You want confirmation, you have to go to reality. Seeking more claims confirms nothing. As one can err, so can many.

Dane: Yes true, I never said it coudl be a hallucination in my mind, but it would be rather striking if 1000's of humans all have been delerious. Not discounting that many may still be wrong!!!!

D: The evidence comes from other persons experiences--

K: Sorry. The fact that other people claim to have had certain experiences is, is not evidence in any sense.

No, it is circumstantial at best. But it alludes that there might be something there.

K: So, if I can get twenty or thirty virgins (yeah, I know, if I can find any) to explain to you that unicorns exist, and that only virgins can perceive unicorns, and if they tell you that they have in fact seen unicorns, will you then choose to believe in unicorns? If I offer you nothing other than these young womens' claims, will you then claim that their 'experiences' are 'evidence' or 'confirmation' of the existence of unicorns?

I will choose to believe that the virgins might see something I am not able to. If they indeed had teh experience, then it Is Real to them! Regardless of what I see or not.
I cannot dicount their experience on the basis of a non-experience from me. I.e. if I haven't seen unicorns ever, they will never exist and thats it. I haven't seen unicorns, does that definately say if they are real or not? Just because I haven't seen them?
No, so they may exist, and to those who say/claim they have indeed seen one, how can I say categorical that they are delusional?

And when you start finding humans who have had similar experiences you affirm your experience with eachother, just like any other club you wanna join.

K: No apologies. I choose to stick to reality to tell me what is true, not clubs, cliques, cults...or religions.

That sounds like an extremely sensible way to deal with reality

Yes, and the authority on any issue is always finally with you yes?




DD - Love Spliff

ex-xian

:notworthy