Iasion

Greetings,

Thanks for your answers, which helped clear up some of the issue of name equivalents.

But,
there still seems to be confusion between Joshua and Jesus.

So,
the OT hero now called Joshua was Iesous in Greek and Yehoshua in Hebrew?

and
the NT hero now called Jesus was Iesous in Greek and Yehoshua in Hebrew?

and
the author now called Jesus son of Sirach was Iesous in Greek and Yehoshua in Hebrew?

So Jesus could be called Joshua and vice-versa because they are equivalent names?

(Or does a convention of translation apply to keep these characters distinct?)


Also,
and separate to any name equivalences, was my question about which form was original in the evidence we have today -

Paul wrote Greek, the Gospels were Greek, the fathers wrote Greek, (then Latin) - all referred to Jesus in Greek as Iesous.

My question remains - when was the earliest document or inscription written in Hebrew which specifically uses the form "Yehoshua" (even though it may not mean much, it seems there is no early such reference.)


Quentin

Celsus

Hi Iasion,

I just found a reference that says Hebrews 4:8 uses "Iesous" to denote Joshua. It just remains for someone with a Greek NT to verify it. CX?

There are no extant Hebrew references to Jesus. Nor are there any Aramaic ones either.

As I recall, there are no extant copies of Sirach in Hebrew or Aramaic (I think the latter is the original language of the book) so we'd be hard pressed to know this for certain. However, Sirach must have been in Greek contemporaneously with the early church (or the Hellenic LXX-using Jews), and I presume their transliteration would be more or less along conventional lines.

Yes. (Heb 4:8)

You're probably not going to be able to get any answers on that one. All the manuscripts you're looking for got burnt in 70CE.

Iasion

Greetings again,

thanks for that helpful answer

So, Jesus and Joshua are the same original name, translated into different English names by context.

Indeed, checking my NT27, I see same name translated differently on the same page:

[*] Heb. 4:8 .. "Iesous" -> Joshua[*] Heb. 4:18 .. "Iesous" -> Jesus


That's quite interesting - it means the translater chooses the word "Jesus" or "Joshua" depending on the context.

Hmm - can you imagine the problem if Joshua had appeared in the transfiguration or somesuch ?!

.. and Iesous went up with some disciples,
and Lo! Iesous appeared in a great light.
and Iesous sayeth unto Iesous...
"Iesous, I Iesous, reveal to thee..."

its like anti-matter and matter...
Jesus and Joshua can never meet

Quentin

(P.S. Can sometime tell me if there is a way to do real Greek sxript here? I thought I saw Peter Kirby do it? can't find it in the FAQ/UBB.)

[ December 22, 2002: Message edited by: Iasion ]</p>

Celsus

Glad to be of assistance. Anyway, no one's ever seen two Iesous' in the same room, now have they?

Joel

Bobzammel

Actually, the Joshua I mean is not the OT heir of Moses, but actually a post-exilic king.