Theli

WJ...

Atheism is not an argument.

You will find that we do not discuss god in the same way they do on christian forums.
The question could just aswell be mirrored back at you. Why do you discuss the existence of god?
Another good question, WJ is:
Why do we get so many christians here who are uppset that we discuss about god's existence?
Do you enter all forums you can find on the internet and criticize people for discussing the forums issues/questions or is there something special about atheists?

Well... we do not invent explainations. If there's something that doesn't have an explaination, we accept that (for the time being).

Ok, here comes the relocation again. Most people that live in the country that you claim is "founded on god" have families, jobs and homes. Do you think they would be willing to leave all that, rather than fight christianitys bigotry?

Let me ask you this WJ, why stay on a sinking ship?
BTW, the question is bogus to begin with. Atheism is not a product that you can buy or sell.

[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Theli ]</p>

Lord Asriel

Does anyone actually understand what this means? I've read the question eight or nine times and I can't figure out what he's talking about.

Jayhawker Soule

Isn't there some rule against reruns so early in the season?

Theli

I found that point abit weird to. It seems to me that WJ answered his own question.

BTW... WJ, are you not going to reply to our answers?

WJ

Hi guys!

Well, thanks for giving my questions some consideration. To be homest, thus far I didn't see any real compelling reasons that make atheism a logically sound choice or consistent non-belief 'system', for folks considering such a choice-atheism. Nevertheless, I will respond to as many questions as I can. Afterall, I agree, this is fun!

First let me appologize for item 5 as it didn't read all that well. I will edit it now:

5. What does it really mean to understand or believe something from reading, comprehending, and otherwise using the tools of logic and reason and other parts of the intellect to determine or [to verify] the true-ness or false-ness of a statement made by someone and/or from a book?

Also, to say it another way, what is the meaning behind, say a JTB [justified true belief], and/or how do you arrive at all your beliefs?

Please keep in mind that of course question was kind of wide-open but thought it would be an interesting one to explore the possibilies... .

Anyway, my first reaction to a lot of responses to item 1 remains a bit sarcastic. Even though this one has been discussed before, it remains a contradiction for the atheists 'specific' belief system viz. God. For instance, I keep hearing in other threads as well as this one that it is perfectly acceptable to debate santa clause, ferries, what have you.

Shall we take a poll to see how silly some of those responses are: how many of you belong and vehemently participate in an Existence of Santa Clause forum?

Can we get past the first question? Who's bullshittin who here?

Give me a break. Do you think all people are ingnorant... ? If I truly believe American ingenuity or philosophy or society or customs and associated beliefs are better than Japan's, why would I constantly be worring about or hammering on Japan's? I would not care because I would know that I have it better. Right? Don't you think you're overlooking the obvious here?

Again how many belong to a ferrie forum? Who knows, maybe you think ferries will appear one day? I guess anything is possible.




[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: WJ ]</p>

reklaw67

The difference is that there doesn't appear to be anyone arguing for the belief in silly things like Santa Claus. If there were such people and those people tried to influence morality and education via the courts or other means because of their belief in Santa Claus you can damn well be sure that there would be Santa Claus forums.

Jack the Bodiless

OK, let's use that analogy. Assume we're all Americans, and that "religion" is the belief that Japan is superior. Assume we're all aJapanIsGreatists here.

OK, now consider the following:

There are big temples all over the US, with a big Rising Sun flag on each, where Americans are encouraged to go in order to chant "Hail Sony, we bless you for the gift of Walkman" and suchlike.

When you move into a new area or start a new job, your new neighbors/colleagues ask you which Japanese products you revere most, and suggest where you can go to grovel before a statue of the MD of Sony, Mitsubishi, or whichever is your preference.

Your kids are taught in school to recite a pledge of allegiance to "one nation, inferior to Japan, indivisible".

If your aJapanIsGreatism becomes known, you are accused of being in league with Red China.

A former President (father of the current President) suggests that those who do not believe that Japan is superior should not be regarded as citizens of the US, and should leave. Many others share that sentiment, including the opposition Vice-Presidential candidate: you cannot vote for "the other guys" to express your disgust.

It is widely accepted that the Japanese invented morality, and those who do not worship the Japanese must be immoral. As a result, it is illegal in some states for non-Japan-worshippers to seek public office: they are assumed to be moral degenerates.

What would your reaction be?

Hobbs

Of course ferries are real. There's one right down the road from where I live that crosses the Connecticut River every day (well, not during winter when ice gets in the way). I've also ridden a ferry to Martha's Vineyard many times.

Nobody claims these ferries have any magical powers, though, and nobody is trying to compel me to worship them or to get Congress to pass a law saying that to properly pledge allegiance to my country I must also pledge allegiance to the magical powers of the Chester/Hadlyme Ferry. If they were, I'd certainly be vocal in opposing them.

simian

OK everybody, lets list some of the other strongly held viewpoints we argue against as well.

For me:

Young Earth Creationism (but this is tied in with christianity)
UFO-rons (closely resembles a religious belief)
Racism
Anti-medical treatment
Anti-Muslim hatred (so they have a different set of silly religious beliefs than Christians, that does not make them inherently more dangerous)
Anti-gay rights
English-only morons
anti-immunization
anti-GMOs
anti-fuel economy people
those idiots who think AIDS is not caused by HIV
"free energy" idiots
those opposed to birth control
"Kensington Runestone" people
ghost beliefs
John Edwards crap
other "psychic" crap

OK, here is a brief list of the other items I fight against. I am sure there are quite a number of other silly beliefs I fight against as well, I may add some later. As far as I can see, all are equally unjustified beliefs.

Everybody else out there, please list the other silly beliefs you also battle against.

Simian

Hobbs

Given your impressive facility with logic which you have so amply demonstrated, I'm not surprised.